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Vido

EDUCATION! HOW MUCH IS ENOUGH?

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Why? Because there's so much contention as far as education is concerned.....Some Christians argue that education ( higher)  is a necessity as the organisation is in constant need of doctors and lawyers ( and other highly qualified professionals):

 

I realize that the organisation is quite clear about this and that there are no contradictions in its demand; 

 

Be that as it may: just How much is enough?....should a basic senior certificate be considered enough....


  Edited by Vido

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The ideal answer would be: enough education to allow you to support yourself /family while serving Jehovah whole souled. At the same time not putting yourself in any unnecessary spiritual danger while doing so. :yes:

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If we could garantee armageddon would happen tomorrow.......

 

The point is having a skill that will support you in whatever your going to do.  Not everyone will be "full-time" servants;  some will be stable families in congregations raising families.  Don't really see much point to being a poor person that can't make a living because you think not getting educated is righteous.  Those skillful at work will be before kings. 

The rich young ruler:  you know if you meditate on that account Jesus wasn't at first going to ask him to sell everything and be his follower; so it really is a choice.  some in the past go overboard about the rich young ruler not partaking of the invitation but Jesus never judged him for it.  But the point is made that those invited to the heavens need to give up thier affection for the human earthly way of life centered around material things.

 

Prosperity is not a sin and not "materialism"; so education based on meeting the ability to pay bills and provide for a family is not a sin; that being said the scripture says to not use the world to the full; seek first the kingdom........  and yet Jehovah knows you need these things...

 

one thing about it though:  pride pride pride....  pride is a danger.... stay humble humble humble.....  knowledge puffs up.   material prosperity does seem to foster haughtyness feelings.

 

to me its about how you design your life now:  single?  married?  children?  no children?   reach out in full-time service?

 

if your to poor can you honestly get married?  If you have a low paying job do you really want 2 or three jobs to pay bills?

 

education is not a sin-  its a choice-

the brothers see some pitfalls--- but many of those who have taken the lead were university educated.  But its about obtaining some kind of skill and not a peice of paper from the world.

 

This world is crumbling and falling and so will your mortgage payment:  keep things simple.  The great "reset"  is coming.  whatever "riches"  and digital bank accounts you get now will be gone.  just have enough to get by with.

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Hi Brother Vido,

 

Back in JAN 2015, there was a JW Broadcast where a member of the Governing Body addressed this issue of higher education head on. Possibly this was done because of some controversy on this issue and how we often hear different opinions on it. So as a suggestion you might enjoy watching it again!  I believe Brother Morris delivers this part of the program right at the very beginning of the Broadcast, so it is easy to find and start watching.

Also, if you would like to have some notes on this part, I took some notes back then and posted these, below is the link for you. I hope the notes help but watching the video will definitely help anyone who has any questions about how higher education should be viewed by Jehovah's people.

 

 


  Edited by Beggar for the Spirit

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Before I got the truth I spent 14 years pursuing "good" education 

Then I got the truth .... 

The rest is now history ... 

Diplomas are gathering dust  and I run simple business to support my reg.aux pioneering

My experience so far? 

Jehovah provides abundantly if we seek the kingdom first. 

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9 hours ago, Gregexplore said:

Before I got the truth I spent 14 years pursuing "good" education 

Then I got the truth .... 

The rest is now history ... 

Diplomas are gathering dust  and I run simple business to support my reg.aux pioneering

My experience so far? 

Jehovah provides abundantly if we seek the kingdom first. 

That's very commendable my brother...Jehovah will bless you for that. 

 

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After graduation and with the approval of my mother, I went to a LOCAL business college to reinforce the skills I acquired in high school.  I knew it wouldn't be a wise decision to obtain a higher education out-of-state, so I attended business school, yet stayed at home to commute back and forth.  During that time, I auxillary pioneered several times throughout each year of schooling to maintain my spirituality.  (However, I couldn't have done this without strong support from my congregation.)

 

It worked out well in the end.

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On Friday, January 20, 2017 at 10:34 PM, Gregexplore said:

Before I got the truth I spent 14 years pursuing "good" education 

Then I got the truth .... 

The rest is now history ... 

Diplomas are gathering dust  and I run simple business to support my reg.aux pioneering

My experience so far? 

Jehovah provides abundantly if we seek the kingdom first. 

What an encouraging experience you shared there!

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On January 20, 2017 at 7:13 AM, Vido said:

Why? Because there's so much contention as far as education is concerned.....Some Christians argue that education ( higher)  is a necessity as the organisation is in constant need of doctors and lawyers ( and other highly qualified professionals):

 

I realize that the organisation is quite clear about this and that there are no contradictions in its demand; 

 

Be that as it may: just How much is enough?....should a basic senior certificate be considered enough....

 

Actually the society doesn't need us to go to college or university's to become doctors or lawyers. Years ago it was necessary for several bethelites to go to law school (broadcast 2015). One. Is a family friend and has served in bethel close to 40 years many of which have been as an international lawyer defending our brothers rights all over the world.   We also hosted a bethel brother for a weekend and his wife is a nurse there. She was a LPN (practical nurse) but the branch decided they only wanted RNs (registered nurse) so she and several others completed training for that. Nowadays if the brothers need a speciality in anything they can reach out to the brothers (and sisters) amongst the congregations. I think that's why they keep clarifying that a ton of extra education is not necessary. If we want to be in the health field choose nursing or legal field paralegal. There are many options.  

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Enough is enough when two teachers tells you that:

 

1. Colleges don't care about you, but your MONEY.

 

2. People goes to colleges for 4  years and end up flipping hamburgers. And I will fires would go with this.

 

Believe I was told about this about this from two different teachers at 2 separate times around 23 years ago when I was taking pre college classes. I think Jehovah was telling me something and that is be careful!!

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i got ask a lot how come i never went to collage 

one bro for years just keep asking and asking i dont know what part of im content he didn't understand 

i all so have noted that Collage and not friendly to those with disables 

 

i understand why none witness ask

i dont under why witnesses ask  


  Edited by bobby

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15 minutes ago, bobby said:

 

i understand why none witness ask

i dont under why witnesses ask  

 

It's ok Bobby, sometimes what we do with our lives doesn't make sense to other people and so they ask questions. .

 

It is possible that your Witness friends just want the best for you and were trying to help..

 

It is good that you are content, Jesus said if we had sustenance and covering, food and clothes, we would be ok..

 

You are doing what Jesus said to do...Great job!..Keep up the Excellent work habits, Jehovah smiles when He looks at you....

 

I love you Brother,  I am looking forward to meeting you sometime. ..:)-D  Maybe we can make a Starship together,  who knows?..that would be an exciting enterprise, for sure....

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http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2009/01/13/is-a-ged-more-valuable-than-a-phd.html

 

......Some interesting feedback on education. Yes, there are some openings for DRs. but the stats on baccalaureate degrees and masters have been static for years - yes, I worked on those stats.

 

Generally, where can you find a person with a masters degree? Standing behind a kiosk selling tie dyed T-shirts.

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Colleges these days are viewed as the path to big money. The problem is this system is falling apart and jobs with a live able wage are disappearing. Everyone seems to going to college to get one of the few high paying  jobs left, but there are not nearly enough to go around. Some of the engineers at work now regret having gone to college. They are making less then they expected and may end up working most of their lives trying to pay off their student loans. One wished he skipped college and just got a regular job with lower pay but no student debt. The system is broken.

 

What college is supposed to be about is they were to teach you how to learn. They were to be a starting point, not a merit badge factory. Most colleges seem to be totally failing at teaching people how to learn, most college grads act as if they know it all already and no one is as ignorant as a closed mind. A haughty college person is an idiot and completely missed the real purpose of a college education. (A little secret, the haughtyness is a defense mechanism for the insecure who doesn't want you to find out how little they really know) A better choice is to read. Read the Bible, the publications and whatever science or technology interests you. I never went to college, but have always been a big reader and I tend to run  circles around most college grads. My kids schools are filled with college grads most of whom couldn'the change the oil in their car or replace an electric wall switch. The brothers are right about practical skills, they will aways be in demand while most college office jobs will probably end up in India or being replaced by a smart program. 

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Vuyani, Mholo my broer!!! Unjani?  I hear what you are asking because- well, I'm in Cape Town, en toe, weet ons hoe dit gaan ne?   Will translate for the brothers - Vuyani, Hello my brother!! How are you?.................. and so,  we know how things are, yes?

 

yes,  with the way things are here with unemployment in S Africa, everybody is pushing for higher education. But look who pushes it- the universities and colleges themselves. They are also a business. They also want to make money and so they push very hard for customers. A little while ago, I think it ws a c overseer that said in S Africa,  there are 2 types of unemployed. !) the uneducated unemployed and 2) the educated unemployed. But they are both unemployed!! 

It is in situations like this that our loyalty to Jehovah is tested. Who do we rely on- our educated self.......... or on Jehovah? He says, "Test me out please...." (Mal 3:10). When we are obedient in opposition to man's logic, then we are testing Jehovah and He will NEVER let us falter.  

I know. I was retrenched in 2012. I joined my wife as a reg pioneer and have not looked back. The blessings outweigh the "sacifices" so much, that it makes me see what a joke this world really is. A sick joke.

So Vuyani, put Jehovah to the test in a good way.  You will never be sorry.

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On 20/03/2017 at 0:10 AM, GordonP said:

..... everybody is pushing for higher education. But look who pushes it- the universities and colleges themselves. They are also a business. They also want to make money and so they push very hard for customers.

I so agree with you, brother Gordon, only not just in South Africa. I was talking to someone just yesterday and one of our colleges here are currently training 1200 nurses in their final year of study, which is 4 years.  The problem is there are only 500 placement vacancies which is a 200 placement increase on 4 years ago when they started studying, due to a new hospital having been completed in that time.  However, there are going to be 700 fully trained RN's looking for work at the end of this year.  And that's just nurses.

 

This problem is not going to go away, it will just get worse as the system deteriorates. But Jehovah will always look after his loyal servants. 

 

 

 

 

 

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My experience is i started in a construction trade for some 12 years, when construction work dried up i took computer courses for a year and a half and that got me through the next 10 years then when that computer work was sent oversees, i did cleaning work for 5 years and now im back to the same  construction work. When you stay within Jehovah's frame work things seem to workout ok. Yes there is stress along the way , but  thats life in this system.

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The Faithful slave does not recommend higher education under most circumstances although in the end each one has to decide what he or she will do.  If one does pursue a college or university education one should be seeking a major that will help them support themselves and examine how they will remain spiritual.  perhaps living at home while they do so instead of on  the university campus.  Often times though this is not possible, thus the caution.

 

It should be noted that when the faithful slave talks about higher education they are not talking about one year or two year certificate or associate degree programs at junior/community colleges.  I'm not sure what they call these programs in other countries or if they are available in all countries.  Many of these schools although they often don't carry the prestige of universities, have programs that can prepare a person for some jobs and give a person more qualifications.

 

Here in Washington State they have a program for some high school students called running start.  Some teenagers can take community college classes at local community colleges and earn some or a lot of community college credit while in high school.  Some including Witness young people have earned a certificate or even an associates degree along with their high school diploma.  

If they did decide to pursue a higher education they would be half way finished already.  So instead of four years they would have two years to go.  Or they could just be satisfied with what they have so far and look for a job.  I know that there are other states that have similar programs.


  Edited by JW2017

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How much is enough differs depending on the individual and circumstances.

 

One individual may be in a position where they could go directly to work washing windows with no post-secondary education while pioneering, and I think that's a wonderful thing to do. But what if another individual had ageing parents with no savings in an area where the cost of living is high who decided to go down the same path. Would that be wise, knowing that in a few years their parents will need financial help that the persons current job would not be able to provide?

 

The Governing Body's message is to get only enough education as is necessary to put yourself in a position that will allow you  to serve Jehovah whole souled, while caring for your obligations. They rightly warn of the dangers associated with pursuing higher education.

 

Another thing to keep in mind is that not all courses available are geared towards careers (for example many degrees in the arts and humanities) and many study these topics only to end up flipping burgers at mcdonalds because few jobs exist in those fields.

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McDonald's offers training at "Hamburger U"  http://corporate.mcdonalds.com/mcd/corporate_careers/training_and_development/hamburger_university.html

 

I know of several successful persons who have chosen this practical career path.   OT, but McD burgers are never flipped, as I understand it.  You are correct, many have completed 4 year degrees and are then in competition with persons who have been in the work force during those same years, and have had promotions, while the college grad is 4 years behind and may be in serious debt.  

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Whatever might give you the possibility to earn a living with as little education as possible. You are, of course, free to get as much education as you want, but the time you spend at college or attending lectures might erode your spirituality.

https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2005726#h=1:0-28:129
https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2013764#h=22:0-29:846


Johan

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