Jump to content
JWTalk - Jehovah's Witnesses Online Community

Jehovah's Witnesses' land sell-off has Brooklyn dreaming big


We lock topics that are over 365 days old, and the last reply made in this topic was 4568 days ago. If you want to discuss this subject, we prefer that you start a new topic.

Recommended Posts

Jehovah's Witnesses' land sell-off has Brooklyn dreaming big

New building occupants could tranform surrounding neighborhoods of Brooklyn Heights, Dumbo.


By Amanda Fung | crain's new york business .com


Behold: The day of the biggest real estate sale to hit Brooklyn in decades is nearing and a swelling crowd of potential beneficiaries is salivating. At stake are 34 mint-condition properties in Brooklyn Heights and Dumbo that the Jehovah's Witnesses spent decades accumulating and now are considering selling as they ponder a headquarters move upstate. All told, the portfolio spans 3.2 million square feet—more than the entire Empire State Building—and is worth well over $1 billion.

“There is great potential here to transform the surrounding neighborhoods,” said Marty Markowitz, Brooklyn borough president.

Even with the sale likely a few years away, he and others are dreaming big about what could be. For the city, the sales could return the holdings of the largest landlord in Brooklyn Heights and vicinity—the nonprofit Watchtower Bible and Tract Society of New York, the Witnesses' business arm—to the city's tax rolls. The move could net City Hall millions of dollars a year in revenue.

Meanwhile, backers of the nearby Brooklyn Bridge Park have already tentatively factored the sale of some of the Witnesses' properties into the park's long-range funding plans, and developers are eyeing the possibility of vast amounts of new housing and office space. The Witnesses themselves offer some other suggestions.

“These would be good for universities or a senior-housing operator,” said Richard Devine, a spokesman for the Witnesses, referring to half a dozen buildings linked by brightly lit, spotless tunnels that the Witnesses dug over the last 35 years.

Academic opportunities

It wouldn't be the first time schools have put Watchtower properties to use. Brooklyn Law School and New York University snapped up 89 Hicks St. and 67 Livingston St., respectively, for dorms when the Watchtower started selling properties in 2004.

Since moving its headquarters to Brooklyn in 1909, the group has built a sprawling, self-sustaining community. It keeps all of its properties in mint condition, a stewardship so good it has even been commended by the city Landmarks Preservation Commission. The properties are loosely arranged around the 305,000-square-foot headquarters at 25 Columbia Heights at the edge of Brooklyn Heights, where most of its holdings are used for housing. In Dumbo and a narrow slice of downtown Brooklyn, the Witnesses own buildings used for storage and maintenance facilities, as well as lots for parking.

The Witnesses' first big shift came seven years ago when they shipped their printing plant off to Wallkill, N.Y. There, it primarily turns out two monthly publications, Watchtower and Awake!, which boast a combined circulation of more than 70 million.

“Brooklyn was known as the center of publishing and a shipping hub,” said Mr. Devine, who notes that today, his organization has 1,500 members living in the borough, less than half the peak number. “Our reasons for being in Brooklyn are no longer valid.”

That is why the Witnesses bought a 250-acre forested site in Warwick, N.Y., two years ago. It is now pursuing plans to build a campus there. Next month, the Witnesses will present their final environmental impact study, a crucial step in their effort to get approval to build. If all goes well, the Witnesses could get a green light to proceed within a year, observers noted.

Meanwhile, the Witnesses have put eight Brooklyn Heights properties—ranging from a carriage house to a seven-story apartment building, with a total of 58,000 square feet—on the block with an asking price of $37.25 million.

Mr. Devine declined to comment on the time frame for the sale of the rest of the properties and on the group's Brooklyn exit, but it looks inevitable. The timing could not be better.

“The city needs more housing, and that will only become truer as the decade progresses,” said Hugh Kelly of consultancy Real Estate Economics, who is also a clinical associate professor at the NYU Schack Institute of Real Estate. He notes that with all the office development at the World Trade Center and elsewhere in lower Manhattan, more employers are drawing staff from Brooklyn—and that Dumbo and Brooklyn Heights are seen by many as ideal hotbeds of such creative talent.

Housing development has already begun. The Witnesses' old warehouse on the waterfront, which sold for $205 million in 2004, is now a 438-unit luxury condo.

Home builder Toll Brothers is among those interested. David Von Spreckelsen, a senior vice president at Toll, said he has expressed interest in all the properties, particularly those in Dumbo. He calls them “blank slates to work on.”

The 3.1-acre parking lot on 85 Jay St. that is already zoned for residential development is a prime example. Several years ago, the Witnesses got city approvals to build a tower with nearly 1,000 residential units there, but pulled back on those plans due to the recession, according to Mr. Devine.

At the other end of the spectrum is the elegant Hotel Bossert at 98 Montague St., where the Brooklyn Dodgers celebrated their only World Series win in 1955.

Lots of interest

The properties' appeal is already becoming evident. Since the Witnesses put five residential properties up for sale last month, Ellen Newman, the Corcoran Group broker exclusively marketing the houses, said she has had dozens of showings.

Massey Knakal, the brokerage marketing two residential buildings and one five-story townhouse for the Witnesses, also reports a high level of interest.

“Every type of buyer is interested: developers looking to convert the properties to condo, institutions that want to use the properties or rent them out,” said Robert Knakal, chairman of the brokerage.

The options for the properties are endless. Mr. Markowitz said a new hotel or an economic development incubator would be feasible in areas that are not zoned residential. Businesses would also benefit. There are more than 90 tech startups and hundreds of creative firms in Dumbo, according to Alexandria Sica, executive director of the Dumbo Business Improvement District.

“We need space for growth,” she said.

Oddly enough, after decades of complaining about the Witnesses and their huge presence in the area, some longtime residents are already saying that they will be missed.

“They are good neighbors,” said Judy Stanton, executive director of the Brooklyn Heights Neighborhood Association, adding that they keep their buildings in top shape.

But more important, “many people in the Heights take advantage of their skilled workforce, their carpenters, stonemasons and plumbers,” said Ms. Stanton, who used a Witness to paint her house.

A version of this article appeared in the October 17, 2011 print issue of Crain's New York Business.

Article Source: crain's new york business .com

 


I have a website about healthy low carb eating, nutrition, and weight loss. Come join CarnivoreTalk.com and learn more!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

"There is great potential here to transform the surrounding neighborhoods,” said Marty Markowitz, Brooklyn borough president.

I was thinking the same thing, but probably not in the same way.

It will be interesting to visit Brooklyn Heights in 10 years time. We were just there 6 months ago and you already don't want to walk there at night. Imagine what it will be like without most of the witnesses and instead college kids :eek:

Plan ahead as if Armageddon will not come in your lifetime, but lead your life as if it will come tomorrow (w 2004 Dec. 1 page 29)

 

 

 

 

Soon .....

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Now there's a nice balanced informative article without the snide comments and digs of the other article.

Am I the only one that thinks this move is BIG ... these changes are monumental - the brothers are changing gears, stepping it up .... something big is coming I feel it in my toes!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Now there's a nice balanced informative article without the snide comments and digs of the other article.

Am I the only one that thinks this move is BIG ... these changes are monumental - the brothers are changing gears, stepping it up .... something big is coming I feel it in my toes!

Me too!!(<img src=)'>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think the changes are just a good business move.

Get out of Brooklyn - it has a big bullseye on it. Planes fly into buildings, perhaps Statue of Liberty is next, who knows. New York City is an iconic town with easy access.

So how do we protect ourselves? Head for the mountains :)

And send the presses to Canada.... "What's Canada?" -> Exactly!

 


I have a website about healthy low carb eating, nutrition, and weight loss. Come join CarnivoreTalk.com and learn more!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Heading for the country makes sense to me if something BIG is definitely planned. Time is short for this system, and Jehovah knows His timetable.

The writing is definitely om the wall for this system of things and maybe Jehovah is now moving to protect His earthly arrangements, getting ready for His Day. Selling off and consolidating and using the revenue for the Kingdom work makes sense to me. Whatever it is this is truly monumental and a theocratic milestone.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Heading for the country makes sense to me if something BIG is definitely planned. Time is short for this system, and Jehovah knows His timetable.

The writing is definitely om the wall for this system of things and maybe Jehovah is now moving to protect His earthly arrangements, getting ready for His Day. Selling off and consolidating and using the revenue for the Kingdom work makes sense to me. Whatever it is this is truly monumental and a theocratic milestone.

I absolutely agree. I've never seen anything like this. Jehovah has blessed His people so bountifully enabling them to make this momentous move.

Something's coming...something big!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, the last time we saw something this "Big" was when Patterson was built 1990 - 2000. They moved the Gilead school and now we have all these new "schools". I look forward to seeing all the new training that we will get with this new move as well.

Plan ahead as if Armageddon will not come in your lifetime, but lead your life as if it will come tomorrow (w 2004 Dec. 1 page 29)

 

 

 

 

Soon .....

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The schools will certainly speed up the preaching work. And certainly there will be massive amounts of education for us all once the new system arrives.

And we know what else could be coming any day........ Has anyone else been thinking about Ezekiel 38 and Daniel 2 ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You know, back when 9/11 happened it scared me that some of the damage could affect the brothers in Brooklyn. I was trying to figure out where they were versus the damage and if they got that cloud of horrid dust from the falling towers.

I remember praying to Jehovah that the brothers and HQ would be Ok and it also occured to me to pray that Jehovah help the governing body decide if they should move the HQ because it was getting too dangerous to be in a big city that could be under attack again like that. I think Jehovah answered a lot of friend's prayers by preparing them to move to a "safer" location. I feel real good about this move!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I remember when 9/11 happened that I was scared for the brothers in Brooklyn, worried about how far and what direction that horrid dust cloud from the towers falling would be from the brothers.

I remember praying to Jehovah that they would be alright and also realizing it was not safe anymore to be in a big city like that which would be a major bullseye for any enemies to try and destroy. I prayed to Jehovah that he would help the governing body decide what was the best thing to do ... that they should probably move out into a safer area (country, no big city).

So I feel tremendously good about this move ... it feels right and I know that with as many potential buyers already looking at the buildings for sale (which are in outstanding condition because of the brother's maintaining and upgrading them over the years), that this will be like lifting a burden off their shoulders!

I agree with you guys, that this is the best thing for the HQ in a long time!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I was trying to figure out where they were versus the damage and if they got that cloud of horrid dust from the falling towers.

When I toured Bethel in 2004, my tour guide told us that much of the footage of the first plane flying into the tower was actually filmed at Bethel. A brother was working on repairing a camera, and pointed it out the window to test it, and happened to catch the first plane flying into the first Trade Tower. He was like "You not going to believe what I just caught on camera!"

They then freely handed the clip over to the major news networks.

 


I have a website about healthy low carb eating, nutrition, and weight loss. Come join CarnivoreTalk.com and learn more!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I love the verbiage used in this article -

The title: "Hallelujah! Jehovah's Witnesses' land sell-off has Brooklyn dreaming big" (Yes - PRAISE JEHOVAH - Indeed!!!)

The map description of the properties: "Jehovah's Properties" (Got that right)

Also, below the map: "View Jehovah map in a larger map" (Well, a piece of it anyway...)

The Bee

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.

About JWTalk.net - Jehovah's Witnesses Online Community

Since 2006, JWTalk has proved to be a well-moderated online community for real Jehovah's Witnesses on the web. However, our community is not an official website of Jehovah's Witnesses. It is not endorsed, sponsored, or maintained by any legal entity used by Jehovah's Witnesses. We are a pro-JW community maintained by brothers and sisters around the world. We expect all community members to be active publishers in their congregations, therefore, please do not apply for membership if you are not currently one of Jehovah's Witnesses.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.

JWTalk 23.8.11 (changelog)