Unconfirmed reports she is a sister ~ MISSING

[sunshine]

I hope Alan has a way of receiving the thanks because that was a wonderful post. It's hard to find reliable information so it was lovely to hear a first hand account.

Satan must be furious that something meant to crush the hearts of the faithful finds more sheeplike ones and has Whitney safe in Jehovah's memory to come back and be with her family again. I hate this system, I loath and detest the pain it causes but I am proud and humbled to be permitted to be part of Jehovah's family. Agapé to all the friends and to Whitney's family.

[Willow]

Brother Travis - have received several accounts from friends in her congregation and this one that you posted from Facebook is being questioned by them as it contains some inconsistencies, (it was removed from the Facebook page as soon as it was notified it contained inaccuracies) was not authorized by the family (not that anyone shouldn't be able to keep their own journal but for some reason, the friends are telling me the family does not approve of this one) and lastly, they don't know who this brother is nor what his motive is. (Not that his whole timeline is wrong, but I was told it contains "inaccuracies"), and.. you will see why I am concerned when you read below. Do you personally know Alan? That would help them if they could identify him and clear up some of these issues. It would be awesome if you do know him!

In fact, when I decided to research where this Facebook post has gone (which is all over the place!), the first "hit" was for a website with Jehovah's Witnesses in the name but it was an apostate web site with this as it's first post about it:

"found this here: http://www.jwtalk.net/forum/read.php?49,130679,page=4"

Yeah - that's a link right to this page! Your entire post was pasted into their web page. (Now, I'm sure I'll be mentioned on their site for posting this!!!) I don't mean to be calling you out on this brother, any one of us could have posted that. It certainly is encouraging and seems legit.

Brothers and sisters - I have been waiting for an "official", verifiable "timeline" before I posted on here and even then, I'm a bit concerned about doing it in light of some recent so-called experiences that are being promoted as being from us but turn out being glommed on to by the apostates, changed, and then re-circulated as being from us. I believe this is one of the concerns and reasons for the Faithful Slave's admonition against posting unofficial or unconfirmed information (or, even confirmed and official info. such as notes from special events, recorded talks, etc.) on the internet? The apostates have their own agenda and job to do and the internet is turning out to be a wonderful tool for them just as it is for us...

But for now, I have been asked (by members of her congregation - I personally know immediate relatives of the friends in her congregation who were first-hand involved in this incident) to clarify that the so-called timeline from Alan on Facebook contains some inaccuracies, and is not approved by the family. I know for a certainty that 1 inaccuracy is about the status of the murderer in the congregation. He was baptized, but his actions show that he was not a JW as JWs do NOT act this way.

Every one else is having a hey day with the Facebook pages that were put up to help find her. One administrator of a page posted this today:

"I was asked to take down Chelsea's things by her mother due to the fact that she was tired of trying to defend her daughter and it upset her seeing all the negative comments. I want you all to know how disgusted I am in you for what you have said about her and Whitney would be too. You do not treat a human being like that... This has made me really think about shutting this page down but when I see the missing photos of all the other people I know I can't. So here if your FINAL warning. I am done being polite and nice to you. If I see you disrespecting this page I will call you out on it and you will be blocked...There are plenty of other places you can spread your negativity..."

For now, I just wanted to get the message out about the post from Alan...

[Jordan]

That's good to know willow - thank you. I often worry about digital information and the ease at which you can modify it.

[Joey]

Is the letter a total fake? It is so odd that someone would do that. ~Strange ~ .

[Willow]

Is the letter a total fake? It is so odd that someone would do that. ~Strange ~ .

I want to again re-state that the message I got was that this particular letter contained "inaccuracies" - was how it was worded. And again, I personally believe they are referring to this statement, "Why, he even has gone to some meetings at their Kingdom Hall!" Because much of it is pretty consistent with the emails I have gotten from others in Sister Heichel's congregation.

[Joey]

So there is a brother named Alan who went over the baptism questions with her ? Or do you know if that was inaccurate also ?

Is the letter a total fake? It is so odd that someone would do that. ~Strange ~ .

I want to again re-state that the message I got was that this particular letter contained "inaccuracies" - was how it was worded. And again, I personally believe they are referring to this statement, "Why, he even has gone to some meetings at their Kingdom Hall!" Because much of it is pretty consistent with the emails I have gotten from others in Sister Heichel's congregation.

[Willow]

I too, had questions about the identity of Alan so I inquired further and received a message back (I apologize that I can't just post their comments but they ask not to be posted on the internet). I was under the impression they wanted to find out who wrote the letter when I wrote what I did to Travis in my first post. but they clarified that they simply do not know him. Not that they question whether he exists. And they are not assigning any sinister motive to him - just that they don't know what his motive was. (I really don't know what that means exactly. Perhaps they had been asked not to post such information on the internet??? I have no idea. But I do know there has been a lot of support from the D.O. and C.O. there and no doubt specific direction.)

Maybe this will help to understand. Sister Whitney went to 1 congregation before she was married. Her husband went to a different one. When they married, she moved to his congregation. The friends I am hearing from are from that congregation (not the one that she went to when she was single and NOT the one that Alan would be in). Alan who states that he went over some of the baptism questions with her would've been at her former congregation before she was married. The friends I am in touch with do not know Alan but they are not saying he is not a brother. The only things they are saying is there are "inaccuracies" in his letter (if you think about it, that does not seem hard to believe. How could all the friends involved there possibly get all the facts straight? So much going on, so much emotion...) and that BOTH families - Whitney's and her husband, Clint's, do not want it circulated.

You have to realize the brothers and sisters there have all been through a horrendous 2 weeks and are SUPER sensitive to the needs and requests of the families and extremely protective at this time. (And isn't that what we would all want from the brotherhood?) After the horrendous things that have been posted on the Facebook pages about this incident, they are very concerned about any written discussion being posted on the internet for fear of where it could end up, etc. I am sorry if my original post sounded "dark" - I was in a hurry to get out the door but felt the need to get the message out about not further circulating that letter since the messages I got were so strong.

[Joey]

I am relieved to read this , thanks for clarifying matters. Most of the details in the letter I read in the news or saw in news casts but without the more intimate details.

We went through a similar tragedy locally, a sister in my congregation (I just moved from) her pregnant sister was kidnapped and murdered. It's in the Aw magazine . It was very disturbing to us all for quite some time. I think the friends are sincerely interested and concerned when they learn of such tragedies because of the intense love we have for each other and are seeking info from reliable sources.

[ava]

Here is the link to the official Open House Memorial FB page. Beautiful pictures. You can see many who are dressed in casual clothes, apparently they are not witnesses, it's wonderful to see how many from the local community came. The friends have name tags on.

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.244863075640329.57211.239341149525855&type=1

[Musky]

that BOTH families - Whitney's and her husband, Clint's, do not want it circulated.

I'm afraid this ship has sailed. With the Internet, there is no way to "re-cork the bottle".

I have received this same "Alan email" from hundreds of friends from around the country and several from outside the country. I got the first few even before it was posted in this forum. Once it's out there, it is out there. That being said, I read nothing offensive in it "inaccuracies" or not.

[Willow]

that BOTH families - Whitney's and her husband, Clint's, do not want it circulated.

I'm afraid this ship has sailed. With the Internet, there is no way to "re-cork the bottle"...

That being said, I read nothing offensive in it "inaccuracies" or not.

That's pretty obvious! It was a personal request made by brothers and sisters who have been through something so horrid most of us will only ever imagine in our worst nightmares - that WE STOP circulating it. And, it's not a question of it being offensive. Apparently, you have no idea of the possible repercussions ANY inaccuracies could cause in legal issues. (Once you consider the bigger picture, it may become clearer to you why this is so important.) That being said, I felt by honoring the personal request of the families to stop the circulation of that particular account was the TEENSY-EST, TINSEY-EST little thing I could do for those dear families! I was thinking that perhaps others on here who may have forwarded it, could also send a quick note stating the same request - THE FAMILIES ASK THAT IT NOT BE CIRCULATED. But that is totally up to you.

[Musky]

that BOTH families - Whitney's and her husband, Clint's, do not want it circulated.

I'm afraid this ship has sailed. With the Internet, there is no way to "re-cork the bottle"...

That being said, I read nothing offensive in it "inaccuracies" or not.

That's pretty obvious! It was a personal request made by brothers and sisters who have been through something so horrid most of us will only ever imagine in our worst nightmares - that WE STOP circulating it. And, it's not a question of it being offensive. Apparently, you have no idea of the possible repercussions ANY inaccuracies could cause in legal issues. (Once you consider the bigger picture, it may become clearer to you why this is so important.) That being said, I felt by honoring the personal request of the families to stop the circulation of that particular account was the TEENSY-EST, TINSEY-EST little thing I could do for those dear families! I was thinking that perhaps others on here who may have forwarded it, could also send a quick note stating the same request - THE FAMILIES ASK THAT IT NOT BE CIRCULATED. But that is totally up to you.

Please calm down

I never said I was circulating it. I also never said it was OK to continue to circulate it. I was just pointing out the fact that it is a moot point now that it is out there in circulation, especially having it posted on a site like Facebook (which I do not use).

[GoldAussieGirl]

just wanted to express my absolute heartfelt sorrow at the loss of Whitney.

Im on the other side of the world and didnt know her personally but reading about what happened and looking at her photos moved me to tears. She was my sister and i cant even imagine how her husband, family and congregation are feeling at this point.

All i can do is continue to pray to Jehovah to strengthen and comfort them and help them to endure through what is remaining of this awful system of Satans.

Todays watchtower was very touching and i hope it comforted all those who knew her.

Sleep peacefully in Jehovahs memory and i hope to meet you in paradise. Rev 21:3,4

[shundawms]

I was thinking the same thing. Especially paragraph 14 and 15. Sometimes I wonder am I the only one now and days getting out my lesson with a box of tissue. And then the last song #134, oh my goodness, not going to make it today with out crying. When our CO came to visit us on the last visit, he explained how the slave had finished the new song book but something was missing. He told us how and why this song was added then asked us to sing it. Let's just say there was not a dry eye in the Hall. Then I went to my parent's Hall to hear him give his talk again and I knew it was coming and said "Ok not going to cry cause I know what he is going to say." well did not work. All my make eye make up was gone...lol I told him after the meeting that every time he comes I cry and this time was really bad. And if I was at Whitney's Hall today...OH MY GOODNESS...

[Jordan]

And then the last song #134, oh my goodness, not going to make it today with out crying. When our CO came to visit us on the last visit, he explained how the slave had finished the new song book but something was missing. He told us how and why this song was added then asked us to sing it.

I haven't heard the story, can you elaborate?

[palmhat]

Hi, I've been thinking about the sinister possibilities and it came to mind that someone may want us to circulate this with the inaccuracies and then promote further that this whole thing was planned by Jehovah's Witnesses for the publicity. Then turn around and expose us as liars when the facts can not be verified or worse are not true. Hey, I know it's reaching and I have probably over thunk this but I wouldn't put it past apostates to initiate such a "machination".

I was an attendant at a District Convention one time when apostates had taken quite a number of our programs. They then returned them to the attendants. One of the friends came back with a program that we had handed them and inside was an apostate leaflet. AND THE ATTENDANTS WERE HANDING THEM OUT!. Of course we cleared out the rest of them but it shows the devious nature of their thinking.

[Jelly]

Here is a nice report, 2 weeks after this tragedy happened: http://portlandtribune.com/go/42-news/122564-a-life-well-loved

[GoldAussieGirl]

Here is a nice report, 2 weeks after this tragedy happened: http://portlandtribune.com/go/42-news/122564-a-life-well-loved

That was a beautiful read....thank you

[trottigy]

That was beautiful.

side note: I love this phrase - "share scriptures from their Jehovah’s Witness Bible". People don't read their Bibles any more. So, they think the words in ours aren't in theirs. Crazy.

Well, I am glad God's word is able to provide them much comfort.

[Musky]

Hi, I've been thinking about the sinister possibilities and it came to mind that someone may want us to circulate this with the inaccuracies and then promote further that this whole thing was planned by Jehovah's Witnesses for the publicity. Then turn around and expose us as liars when the facts can not be verified or worse are not true. Hey, I know it's reaching and I have probably over thunk this but I wouldn't put it past apostates to initiate such a "machination".

The request not to forward "personal accounts" stems from the legal issues regarding the accused murderer:

The family of Whitney and the congregation have requested that no personal experience e-mails at all be forwarded regarding anyone's part in this.

Jonathan Holt has pleaded Not Guilty, and since these e-mails are written it becomes "public". They can be changed, added to, altered, as they are forwarded along.

Even though he has signed a confession, in Oregon, you must be proven guilty through hard evidence. Many confess to protect someone else, or for different reasons.

SO there will be a long, drawn out time in the courts. The friends who have been part of finding evidence, etc, will have to testify.

The concern is finding an unbiased jury. If they have read anything other than the official press, TV or police reports which are public after filing, it could result in them not being able to say they have not been influenced.

[VictorySong]

OK, I promise not to share third/fourth hand information or the message from my friend, who is a friend of the person who is friends of the immediate relatives of the friends in the congregation who supposedly had “first-hand” knowledge of this event and who asked that friend to share it with the other friends because there might be some inaccuracies in it, and which by extension and updated messaging contains that friend’s personal *opinion* about what the inaccuracy in the original email is, honest.

I mean this in the nicest possible way, but we all need to reread the 8/15/11 Watchtower, pg 5, which talks about passing on emails and tells us to ask ourselves, “Do we have permission to pass the information on?” Permission to share this information should come directly from the husband/family, not the friends of the relatives of the friends in the congregation. Please, correct me if I’m wrong. We may not all be *legally minded* in such situations, but we should be *spiritually minded* at all times.

[Musky]

OK, I promise not to share third/fourth hand information or the message from my friend, who is a friend of the person who is friends of the immediate relatives of the friends in the congregation who supposedly had “first-hand” knowledge of this event and who asked that friend to share it with the other friends because there might be some inaccuracies in it, and which by extension and updated messaging contains that friend’s personal *opinion* about what the inaccuracy in the original email is, honest.

I mean this in the nicest possible way, but we all need to reread the 8/15/11 Watchtower, pg 5, which talks about passing on emails and tells us to ask ourselves, “Do we have permission to pass the information on?” Permission to share this information should come directly from the husband/family, not the friends of the relatives of the friends in the congregation. Please, correct me if I’m wrong. We may not all be *legally minded* in such situations, but we should be *spiritually minded* at all times.

Even though in the first part of your post you were obviously trying to be funny, the second part is always good advice. Fortunately, many of the emails shared were things that were said in various news articles with the links included which is not the issue, it is the supposedly "personal experiences" that they are asking not to be emailed around. But, like I said earlier, with all the friends from all over the world concerned about this tragedy, it will be difficult if not impossible to "recall" all of the stories that went out. All we can do is respect their wishes from this time on. I am getting these "first hand reports" from all over the world, just got one from Australia!

[shundawms]

And then the last song #134, oh my goodness, not going to make it today with out crying. When our CO came to visit us on the last visit, he explained how the slave had finished the new song book but something was missing. He told us how and why this song was added then asked us to sing it.

I haven't heard the story, can you elaborate?

I was tring to find the recording but it is on my other computer that is no longer working-hate that. Anyway it was something like when the song book was completed and one of the members of the GB stated that something was missing. We needed a song about Jehovah's Kingdom and how we would feel when we get there. So they went back and song #134 was added. Then he-the CO- stated that while we sing this song, picture not only ours selves but other friends and family as well as all those that had been resurrected. Every since then I have not been able to make it the entire song, nor did I Sunday.

[VictorySong]

I think I better apologize for making a parody of Willow's post. I am new to the list and have not quite figured out the flavor and character of some of the members here [and did not know how to reply privately - I have since figured it out). Regardless, please forgive me Willow and JW Talks, and please don't throw me off the list for this infraction. Even Peter got another chance.

[Joey]

I didn't see anything wrong with your post, but here's a tip the more you mess up on here the more we like ya.

I think I better apologize for making a parody of Willow's post. I am new to the list and have not quite figured out the flavor and character of some of the members here [and did not know how to reply privately - I have since figured it out). Regardless, please forgive me Willow and JW Talks, and please don't throw me off the list for this infraction. Even Peter got another chance.