Be honest: Who enjoys fireworks?

[trottigy]

Is there any real difference in watching fireworks display on the fourth of July and driving around town looking at Christmas lights on December 25th? They are both pretty in their own way. Both celebrations dishonor Jehovah. Each individual must decide for themselves, as they will have to live with their own conscience.

I know I like driving around and seeing the lights too

[Musky]

We had our meeting tonight because our sister congregation has the CO this week. As we went outside to leave, the high school about two blocks away was putting on their fireworks display, so we had front row seats. Our whole congregation stood outside and enjoyed the beautiful show and nobody left the parking lot until it was over. It was a gorgeous summer evening and the colors were amazing. Very enjoyable!

[loginphp]

sorry, I did mean the tree of knowledge and Jehovah said not to look at unclean things and although the tree was not unclean the principle is not to look at something that could temp us or stumble anyone, after all could you see Jesus having any part of a false governments celebration. Would you go to a Christmas celebration not to celebrate but to see the pretty packages? Whats the difference, even if no one sees you watching, Jehovah does. This is the one holiday, (do to the laws because of dangers), that we can't do any other time of year, Christmas is no big deal we can give gifts anytime same goes with valentines day, mothers day and all the other holidays that we can do anytime. What would you do if your mate kept staring at another person of the opposite sex stating "they were just admiring their beauty" what would you do? Would you understand or would you feel that that might lead to immorality. This is a very patriotic holiday it's a way of showing nationalism anyway you look at it. Most people celebrate it the same way your speaking of, sitting back and watching what is the difference and is that what you think Jehovah would want us to do? It seams like a little thing until you try to explain the difference to a study or your children. It has to go something like this "(study)what did you do last night (witness) oh I watched the fireworks last night (study )so did I, I thought you were not political(witness)oh were not we just like the lights (study)well I just like getting gifts at Christmas time." From experience that will change the way you feel about something that seems innocent.

Very nice comment. I appreciate your faith too and do understand your point. I was wondering though, while I drive around to take care of business I notice there are some churches that have huge crosses outside and I always admire the beautiful plated gold and 'recognize' how attractive gold is, of course I don't start investing in gold though, neither do I start attending that church. Is it reasonable to think Jehovah could be saying "he should not appreciate my gold on that cross"? Did the churches create gold and shiny things?. Does this mean I should disconnect myself from having anything to do with gold? I would think that gold actually has nothing to do with a 'cross' yet I wouldn't go standing outside the church staring at the cross. Now about fireworks, I've said before I would never make it a 'point' to actually attend a stadium to see the fireworks as a personal choice, why? because what if someone sees you there like a Bible study or an opposer or somebody who likes to 'scheme out what is bad'? I'd say attending a stadium to see fireworks could stumble people if they know you're a witness, so why not avoid it? We still have to be discreet in how we go about things without stumbling others.

However, while I look outside my kitchen window or drive around I notice there are some fireworks that are in the sky and I've always admired the beautiful colors and lights and 'recognize' how attractive fire and lights can be, of course I don't start celebrating 4th of July, neither do I go out and buy fireworks. Who is the originator of lights and beautiful colors, the firework stadium? Does this mean I should disconnect myself from having anything to do with a beautiful display of colors and lights in the sky? I feel (and I could be wrong) that watching something like fireworks out my window wouldn't hurt my conscience. About the Christmas gift wrappings, something like that I wouldn't like to do personally, however I also recognize there are some pretty impressive wrappings made on Christmas and very attractive, but of course even though I recognize nice things I will be careful not to associate myself with them because of the origins, but that won't stop me from 'recognizing' beautiful gift wrappings. Is this a conscience thing?

Also, about Jesus when he was talking about looking at a woman. Imagine a beautiful woman walks by and there you are with your wife (or husband). Would the wife or husband say to themselves in their own heart "she is not beautiful! and my mate better not think shes beautiful or he will be on the verge of committing adultery"? Well is there a flaw with that statement? Possibly. If married, do we walk around with our mates and never recognize that there are attractive people? Trust me our mates know when we 'recognize' another attractive person and we ourselves know it, and we also know they too see attractive people all over, we can't avoid attractive people and lie and say they aren't attractive. So then where is the danger that Jesus talked about? The problem bases within the "lust" or "passion" for that person, the one who "keeps on looking at a woman so as to have a passion or a lust" for her "in his heart". This does not mean we won't recognize an attractive person when we see them. If our mate asks "is that an attractive person?" and we say NO we are lying. There's nothing wrong with recognizing a beautiful person as that's nature. The danger is of developing a lust or a passion for that other person. How could we relate that with fireworks? Actually we can relate it. If I "keep on looking" at fireworks, and I recognize I have a weakness about having a patriotic spirit, then that "lust" or "passion" for another woman would be equivalent to developing a patriotic spirit, a lust or passion for the purpose of those fireworks which is the celebration of the government. Now, if one has a weakness in this area for fireworks, then by all means he should avoid them for his spiritual welfare. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but that's how I've always understood it.

[Dages]

I do not see the problem with fireworks...

I'm thinking : if we should not watch it... we should not look at the Chrismas decoration in December, right ?

So prepare a bunker with a lot of food in december and do not leave home because this is everywhere.

I assume this is just a tiny conscience matter.

I love fireworks and i enjoy watching them, even for July the 14th (in France...)

[trottigy]

I was thinking it would be similar to the flag salute - you stand out of respect, but don't put your hand on your heart or say it. Similar you may stand to see, but not go to shows for this, as now you are participating.

[Hammerhead]

Its not the fireworks that are wrong in themselves. What do they represent on that particular day. I like fireworks explosives as much as everyone else but because they represent the birthday of this country and independence its kinda like going against Romans 13. The date is also glorifying this country and patriotic fervor runs high on this date. Its not any different than watching a Christmas parade. Perso.ally i have a difficult time visulising Jesus saying to his apostles "come on lets watch Satan and his people celebrating the birthdate of their latest govt that will persecute you". Arent we proclaiming good news of

anlther govt that will solve all of mans problems? Why watch a celebration of one of mans govts? Im off the soapbox.

[loginphp]

Its not the fireworks that are wrong in themselves. What do they represent on that particular day. I like fireworks explosives as much as everyone else but because they represent the birthday of this country and independence its kinda like going against Romans 13. The date is also glorifying this country and patriotic fervor runs high on this date. Its not any different than watching a Christmas parade. Perso.ally i have a difficult time visulising Jesus saying to his apostles "come on lets watch Satan and his people celebrating the birthdate of their latest govt that will persecute you". Arent we proclaiming good news of

anlther govt that will solve all of mans problems? Why watch a celebration of one of mans govts? Im off the soapbox.

You bring up a good point! It's not the fireworks themselves but the day of celebration it's on. I guess it's the same as not accepting presents on Christmas Eve, it's not that gifts are bad but the fact that one could even be accepting a gift on Christmas could be a little twisted. I'm glad I don't make it a point to go out and see the fireworks! Honestly, I can't see Jesus hanging out watching fireworks but he would probably make mention of the Creator and then teach us with an illustration using the fireworks.

[Hammerhead]

Just another point to consider. The star spangled banner that is played and sung thruout the country on events such as this and before sporting events has the words " the rockets red glare and the bombs bursting in air gave proof through the night that the flag was still there". To me watchinv such things may be tantamount to nibbling off the table of demons. Or even looking at the table of demons and admiring the show. Im not righteous by any means and im not looking down on those who choose to view fireworks on independence day. That is your choice. Just my perception is all

[retroHelen]

Noticing how many of us like to see the lights and fireworks worldly people use for their dubious festivals - "Why should the Devil always play the best tunes?" Is an old proverbial saying that comes to mind.

In Jesus' day the Jews had an extra festival in the middle of winter called Hanukkah or the "Festival of Lights". It was not a festival inaugurated by Jehovah, but neither was it based on anything pagan. It was one that happened much later in Jewish history when the Temple was re-dedicated during the time of the Macabees. It involved all families lighting a Menorah, a smaller verson of the giant oil lampstand that was lit at the Temple.The lights at every home and illuminating the Temple would relieve the dark winter for 8 days of the festival. A Watchtower notes that Jesus may have alluded to the festival lights when he called himself “the light of the world”, so Jesus did not comment against this winter festival. Therefore, just as then they had joyful festivals and now we love our Conventions, it would seem logical that Jehovah will have festivals for us in the New World and one based on lights and perhaps fireworks would be very uplifting during the darker shorter days of Winter.><

w98 3/1 98 festival milestones of Jewish history

The Bible’s Viewpoint

Hanukkah—Is It a “Jewish Christmas”? (No- it wasn't in Jesus' day!) w90 12/8

[Musky]

When Bob originally posted this topic he asked "who enjoys watching fireworks", he didn't mention anything about going to a 4th of July celebration and joining the crowd watching the fireworks show. So that is the question most of us answered. From where we live, there are shows all around us where you can see the fireworks just fine from our own yard. We are not "participating" in anything. We are watching the fireworks themselves which are very beautiful. I will not close my eyes so I can't see them or purposely go into the house and shut the blinds. I think this would be a hypocritical, self-righteous and "Holier then thou" attitude and I doubt Jehovah would be impressed with it!

[sweetwillow58]

Just a little anecdote....about driving around to see the "pretty lights" at Christmas time. When my granddaughter was younger we had to take a small trip at night and took the "scenic" route rather than the faster highway route. I explained to those in the car I chose to go that way so my granddaughter could see the "pretty lights". The words were no sooner out of my mouth when I saw some pretty flashing red lights....in my rear view mirror. Police pulling me over cos I had a taillight out. Had to explain to the officer why everyone was laughing hysterically over me being pulled over....gave him a chuckle, too.

[vjohzon]

I agree I can't wait until we are allowed to do things, like fireworks and other things, without a worry of hurting Jehovahs heart it will be so wonderful when we do not have a wrestling with sinful flesh. I do wonder if we knew Armageddon was coming on July 4, would we be outside watching the celebration of fireworks? This is a question I try to ask myself when I have a question about a action on my part.

[Musky]

I agree I can't wait until we are allowed to do things, like fireworks and other things, without a worry of hurting Jehovahs heart it will be so wonderful when we do not have a wrestling with sinful flesh. I do wonder if we knew Armageddon was coming on July 4, would we be outside watching the celebration of fireworks? This is a question I try to ask myself when I have a question about a action on my part.

We are "allowed" to do many things that do not conflict with our worship to Jehovah. Back when fireworks were legal, we used to take them with us when we camped on the beach and set them off. This was NOT on any holiday, this was just for our enjoyment. If it was legal in our area, I would still do it. You are pushing that fireworks in themselves are bad because they are used in a patriotic celebration. That is wrong. This is like the Pharisees attitude about the law covenant, they so narrowly interpreted it that they found fault in Jesus Disciples picking grain and eating it on the Sabbath. It also reminds me of the "Superfine Apostles" in Paul's day.

[GrumpysWife]

WOW---that's quite a stretch: to equate watching fireworks with a man looking lustfully at a woman. Jesus did say that anyone looking at a woman has already committed adultery with her in his heart....but to compare this with watching fireworks to me just isn't logical. I realize you're entitled to your opinion' date=' of course, but fortunately so are the rest of us...If you're going to reach that conclusion, one might ask themselves 'Can you imagine Jesus watching TV?!?!" I think NOT! You could take this even further and apply this to just about anything we do in modern life...This is were balance comes to the fore.[/quote']

Need I say more?

[ava]

I agree that I don't think we are talking about anyone actually going to a 4th of July Celebration. I took my dog outside last night and saw some fireworks, I don't think that qualifies me as celebrating this country's birthday. As to Christmas time, I don't drive around looking at the lights, but we do need to get in our cars and do errands, so yes we see the lights, but again, I don't think that constitutes celebrating Christmas.

Think there has been alot of misunderstanding on this thread.

[amg109]

Our family loves fireworks. When they started being sold in stores we bought some and we had our own little fireworks show at home about a week before the 4th. Fun!

Then we were surprised to see that we could see a big fireworks show from our house the other night. I guess they were shooting them off at the mall or somewhere, so we sat on the porch and watched those.

[Jaylyn]

My very, very faithful grandmother used to take me to see the fireworks as a kid. So I never even thought for a second that some could view watching fireworks as celebrating.

My husband (unbeliever) likes to take his boat out on the lake and watch the firework show they put on over the water. I go with him and whoever else he invites along. I never would of thought of this as celebrating the holiday. Since the WT society has brought out that a wife can attend a christmas dinner with her unbelieving mate, as long as she does not participate in the holiday activities.

[retroHelen]

This photograph was when the whole town came down to the harbour to see the replica famous ship Endeavour - an exact copy with some original timbers of the ship that Captain Cook discovered Australia with 1769-71. He also had astronomers and scientists founders of the Briitish Museum London and the botanist founder of London Kew Gardens on board.You can see it (not playing itself though) mainly on the film "Master and Commander" starring Russel Crowe.It was on it's last voyage from Whitehaven to Sydney which we followed live on the Internet over the following weeks. The town said goodbye with the town band playing sea shanties while we all had song sheets and sang along and there was a massive firework display and all the yachts in the marina hooted and many sailed alongside her for quite a way out to sea. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Endeavour

[GrumpysWife]

We had some "Tall Ships" come into the Boston Harbor. They were just awesome. I didn't get to tour them but I did see them.

They also have a fantastic fireworks display near the harbor, with music played by the Boston Pops Orchestia. We did see them one year but there was so much drinking etc. that we never went again. But I have to admit, it bothered my conscience because it was a celebration of the 4th. I would never do it again. We do enjoy watching from a distance.

[retroHelen]

I thought it was supposed to be a Boston Teaparty!!;)

[GrumpysWife]

I thought it was supposed to be a Boston Teaparty!!;)

They like to party. They don't need an excuse.

[Brother_Bliss]

... after all could you see Jesus having any part of a false governments celebration.

Of course not. However, if firework technology was in use back in Jesus day and they set them off over Jerusalem, I am sure that Jesus and his apostles would be kickin' it back on the Mount of Olives watching them.

What they would NOT be doing, is dressing in patriotic colors, waving flags, singing patriotic songs, or engaging in the drunken revelries along with the inhabitants of the city below.

Would you go to a Christmas celebration not to celebrate but to see the pretty packages? Whats the difference, even if no one sees you watching, Jehovah does.

A Christmas celebration is a false religious observance. Quite a difference! Even so, does this make it wrong to take note of the lights hanging on peoples homes all around you during the month of December? Excluding displays that feature traditional scenes, many light displays are in fact pretty to look at.

The elder who studied the Bible with me made the statement that technically one could be present at a family gathering around the holidays and still not participate in any of it's customs. The Watchtower has made similar statements in connection with a person whose unbelieving mate requests that they be present at family functions around the holidays.

What would you do if your mate kept staring at another person of the opposite sex stating "they were just admiring their beauty" what would you do? Would you understand or would you feel that that might lead to immorality.

This has no relevance to the topic whatsoever. Watching fireworks is not going to inspire me to register as a democrat and vote.

(study)what did you do last night (witness) oh I watched the fireworks last night (study )so did I, I thought you were not political(witness)oh were not we just like the lights

Watching fireworks does not make one political.

I can relate this to my literal young children. When we are driving down the street with them in the back seat and a firework bursts with color in the sky, my kids natural reaction is to ooh and aah and make statements about how beautiful it is. Do they need corrected? No, because they're right. The fireworks are beautiful. My job as a parent is not to try to convince them otherwise, which would only confuse them and perhaps make me look like an unreasonable monster. My job is to teach them why we will not participate in the celebrations themselves.

[Brother_Bliss]

We had our meeting tonight because our sister congregation has the CO this week. As we went outside to leave, the high school about two blocks away was putting on their fireworks display, so we had front row seats. Our whole congregation stood outside and enjoyed the beautiful show and nobody left the parking lot until it was over. It was a gorgeous summer evening and the colors were amazing. Very enjoyable!

And is was not a sin.

In this topic of "Who enjoys fireworks?", they would have all answered affirmatively. If the CO was visiting you all, he would have too.

[Brother_Bliss]

I was thinking it would be similar to the flag salute - you stand out of respect, but don't put your hand on your heart or say it. Similar you may stand to see, but not go to shows for this, as now you are participating.

Spot on as usual, Jerry!

My initial post mentioned local events that were not Independence Day related.

[Brother_Bliss]

When Bob originally posted this topic he asked "who enjoys watching fireworks", he didn't mention anything about going to a 4th of July celebration and joining the crowd watching the fireworks show. So that is the question most of us answered. From where we live, there are shows all around us where you can see the fireworks just fine from our own yard. We are not "participating" in anything. We are watching the fireworks themselves which are very beautiful.

Yes, indeed.

I will not close my eyes so I can't see them or purposely go into the house and shut the blinds. I think this would be a hypocritical, self-righteous and "Holier then thou" attitude and I doubt Jehovah would be impressed with it!

If someone wanted to do this, that is fine. To think that Jehovah would require this, makes him unreasonable. To tell the rest of us that this is what we all should be doing, is imposing your conscience on others, and is offensive.