Pjdriver

That’s the world I live in....including the bed space.

It’s interesting but I wouldn’t put too much stock in poles. Next week there may be another pole putting jw in an unfavorable light.

That’s what I wear when I go skating. PS. Meaning the red pants.

I am Indian and Italian.....from the Wopaho Tribe.

It is a little confusing because the statement that “we don’t know with certainty the shape” is on the website for the benefit of the public. So if you state dogmatically that Jesus was impaled on an upright stake....then your student runs across the website quote....how do you answer????

Thank you, This is the whole point.....whether you lean toward a stake or the cross being the instrument of death, those words will have different meaning. Notice the use of a question rather than a conclusive statement: “does the use of nails (plural) have to be understood.....? .......use of the plural “nails” could have been a general reference ...” You use that quote in response to my saying “why be dogmatic?” But the quote is not dogmatic, so it agrees with the other FS comment quoted earlier, that “there’s no way to know for a certainty” I've noticed this quite a bit; when the faithful slave says something “may be” or “could be” or “seems to be”, many of our dear friends assume it as fact.

As I said, it not conclusive. It could be understood each way. Who knows, maybe the sign created the confusion....but I doubt it.

I find it interesting that in the 4th century CE Constantine introduced the cross as a symbol of Christianity but historically we know of no arguments at the time being made objecting to the shape of the cross, but we do know there was much controversy regarding the use of images in Worship. There was a lot written about major disputes regarding the divinity of Jesus and the use of icons but there doesn’t appear to be any disputing about the shape of instrument of Jesus death. Apparently it didn’t seem to be an issue, unless I’m missing something.

I think There’s a number of different ways that could be answered. There’s just no way to know which answer would be the correct one. However I think the fact that we don’t have the evidence on the exact shape that is 100% conclusive, indicates to me that it’s not all that important. On the other hand we do have clear direction not to use images in our worship. ✝️

Yeah, they were growing out of the ground......when they needed one the just chopped it down.

Funny how we see the same thing differently. i wouldn’t call that stretching out your hands. I would say it looks more like bringing them together so as to restrict there movement. But that’s just me. But again, nothing is conclusive.

This maybe one reason we can’t be sure.. John 20:25 So the other disciples were telling him: “We have seen the Lord!” But he said to them: “Unless I see in his hands the print of the nails and stick my finger into the print of the nails and stick my hand into his side, I will never believe it. John 22:18...when you grow old, you will stretch out your hands....He said this to indicate by what sort of death he would glorify God. So John indicates nails (plural) were used. This could understood to mean one nail in each hand as with a cross. Also tradition is that peter was executed in the manner Jesus was. Note the expression “stretch out your hands” again could easily be understood as referring to a cross. But none of this is conclusive. So why be dogmatic. If cornered I would say we can’t be certain but most evidence leans toward an upright stake. I wouldn’t bother arguing that point much. The matter of using it as an icon of worship is another matter.

Good point! From JW.org “Many view the cross as the most common symbol of Christianity. However, the Bible does not describe the instrument of Jesus’ death, so no one can know its shape with absolute certainty. Still, the Bible provides evidence that Jesus died, not on a cross, but on an upright stake.”

The guy with the dreads, Fkj, is very talented. He plays with different artist and has a few good videos (music).