Some Enlightenment, Perhaps?

[Thesauron]

I read this article from The Christian Post, and this Dr. William Wagner confused me a bit, so perhaps one of you might enlighten me a bit, if possible.

 

http://www.christianpost.com/news/how-do-religions-grow-jehovahs-witness-a-strict-taskmaster-part-3-7-176550/

 

He writes:

In some areas they will put small marks on the doors to designate to other JW's that they have been there.

Has anyone heard of, or tried, this?

 

In one way they have not perfected a Mega strategy — they use the internet but all their material is the same as the printed material. They have failed to try to influence their society by looking at other means and methods.

What does this mean? Do we not try all sorts of methods?

 

(The Christian Post is a non-denominational evangelical newspaper based in Washington, D.C.)

 

 

____

"Where your treasure is, there your heart will be also."—Matthew 6:21.

[Alexa]

John 8:44 You are from your father the Devil, and you wish to do the desires of your father. That one was a murderer when he began, and he did not stand fast in the truth, because truth is not in him. When he speaks the lie, he speaks according to his own disposition, because he is a liar and the father of the lie. Brothr Thesauron  

 

[Thesauron]

John 8:44 You are from your father the Devil, and you wish to do the desires of your father. That one was a murderer when he began, and he did not stand fast in the truth, because truth is not in him. When he speaks the lie, he speaks according to his own disposition, because he is a liar and the father of the lie. Brothr Thesauron  
 

I think he might have us confused with hobos from the 19th century? In many areas they used a in different code language that they carved near entrances to the houses that would mean various things, such as, plenty of food here, or, nasty housekeeper - stay away.


____
"Where your treasure is, there your heart will be also."—Matthew 6:21.

[GeordieGirl]

At the present time their publication and website may be read in 252 languages.

 

Witnesses will typically spend between sixty and one hundred hours a month in their mission work

 

.... when the have these large gatherings their members in the city where the rally is to be held will go from house to house and ask if the would be willing to rent out a room for several days during the rally. They will pay a fair price and then the owners of the house become a target of their evangelism during the time the rally is being held. This method has proven to be successful.

Since when?

 

And there is more of the same incorrect information and inaccurate waffle.  I agree with Alexa, more of Satan's ploys to distract and disconcert.

 

Whoever is not on my side is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters. Matthew 12:30

[EccentricM]

The article is of lies and manipulations. 

 

Quote

expectation that every member be involved in their mission work. If a member does not comply, then that person is expelled from the church.
 

Obviously not, nobody is disfellowshipped for not doing enough hours on the field service, everyone simply does what they are able. Some people cannot do it due to illness etc. We obviously know it is a scriptural command to preach the news of the kingdom, we naturally want to go out and do the preaching work without being forced, for we learn the truth of God's word which moves us to preach. But not a disfellowshipping offence if one struggles to get out. Every individual circumstance is different.  If a person refuses to go out and preach out of defiance it is a different story, for they show themselves willingly going against scripture. 

 

Quote

 heavy loss of those who do not desire to conform with their strict measures
 

 

"Warn a divisive person once, and then warn them a second time. After that, have nothing to do with them."  -  Titus 3:10 (As well as many other scriptures that speak about disfellowshipping of unrepentant sinners) 

 

The manipulation here is that they make it look like we viciously kick people out rather than trying to explain the scriptures to them, making it look like a forced human dictatorship, when in reality we only advocate for laws the bible gives us. The scriptures are simple, the only laws one can reject are Jehovah's laws, as they are the only ones we follow, and generally, these laws are basic moral laws. 

 

"In fact, this is love for God: to keep his commands. And his commands are not burdensome." - 1 John 5:3

 

 

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Although they have many new converts come into the church they also have a rather heavy loss of those who do not desire to conform with their strict measures
 

 

"So the last will be first, and the first will be last." - Matthew 20:16

 

 

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more of a lecture hall than a church.
 

What 'defines' a "church"? A church is a word for "gathering". If we look into the many scriptures of many talks and letters of the apostles to the early congregations, they are of the same style as we use today. Not just dead reading without education, spiritual building or without encouragement. A congregation is not just a place of biblical reading and repetitive prayers, but a place of learning the real applications and meaning of God's words. How else are you meant to know how to worship Jehovah if you are not taught what the bible means and how to apply it to your life? You can often tell the difference between someone who goes to KHs and the Churches, because many people who go to churches have no idea of basic biblical knowledge other than every day morals and a list of rules and that "Jesus died for us", without even knowing what that entails.  Many churches today even just give speeches without even opening the bible. 

 

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While most missiologists will emphasize contextualization in cross cultural settings, the JWS do not seem interested in making their message more acceptable by using these tools in working with people of a different culture.
 

Kinda like... the Romans when they included pagan rituals in their worship in order to promote "cultural acceptance"? God's word and law is above all worldly man made cultures and systems, it is his way, and the ways of Christ we follow, they cannot be shaped or altered to suit a culture that is not of Christ's ways. If the Kingdom message from the bible is not acceptable to you, then that is that, it will not change, only the person can change and accept God's standards.  

 

"You were taught to put away the old personality that conforms to your former course of conduct and that is being corrupted according to its deceptive desires. And you should continue to be made new in your dominant mental attitude,*and should put on the new personality+that was created according to God’s will in true righteousness and loyalty." - Ephesians 4:22-24

 

Facing language barriers and showing everyone the same love and respect is enough to preach across all cultures, and this shows as we have already preached in multiple lands and cultures with success. 

 

 

The problem with this article is that it views Christian denominations as some sort of competition, or popularity contest. The truth is not about being popular, or getting points,  it's simply about truth it's self, and giving people the chance to see it.  

 

"But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it." -  Matthew 7:14

 

 

Edited April 13, 2017 by EccentricM

[jwhess]

21 minutes ago, GeordieGirl said:

At the present time their publication and website may be read in 252 languages.

 

Witnesses will typically spend between sixty and one hundred hours a month in their mission work

 

.... when the have these large gatherings their members in the city where the rally is to be held will go from house to house and ask if the would be willing to rent out a room for several days during the rally. They will pay a fair price and then the owners of the house become a target of their evangelism during the time the rally is being held. This method has proven to be successful.

Since when?

 

And there is more of the same incorrect information and inaccurate waffle.  I agree with Alexa, more of Satan's ploys to distract and disconcert.

 

Whoever is not on my side is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters. Matthew 12:30

When I was younger, all of our big District and International Assemblies (yes we called them assemblies) had a rooming department.  Many weeks before the assembly date, the brothers would canvass the neighborhoods looking for rooms to house the attendees.  The last time that I shared in that type of lodging was the year after I was married, in 1971 in Jackson, Michigan (USA).  The convention was held at an outdoor race-track.  A nice older couple had guest rooms in their basement.  They never said much to us after we first met them, but each night when we would return to their home, they would look up from the TV and say,  "WE saw your meeting on the news tonight."  Staying in the private homes of worldly people would be too much of a risk for them and us today.

 

EDIT:  a side point, my future wife and her parents and siblings were just starting to attend meetings.  They traveled several hundred miles to attend an assembly in Buffalo. New York (middle 1960's).  They followed another witness family who had five in their group.  The rooming department had  arranged a private home for them.  When they finally got there, there was a mistake.  The home-owner thought the request was for TWO people.  He got TWO families.  To say that it was crowded is an understatement  (sleeping on the front porch, etc).  Ah, the memories.

Edited April 13, 2017 by jwhess

[LeslieDean]

3 hours ago, Thesauron said:

 

(The Christian Post is a non-denominational evangelical newspaper based in Washington, D.C.)

I thought non-demoninational was just another fancy word for false religion.

[Skyler]

Satan is the god of this system, and for every good article there will be dozens more that spread misinformation to flat out lies. To be honest, should we really delve deeper into propaganda we stumble upon or even view sites based on false religion?

[Nnaemeka]

Or another synonym for spiritual prostitutes. 

[Thesauron]

I thought non-demoninational was just another fancy word for false religion.

It might. Or it might just mean a mix of all religions. Either way, that particular article seems to be filled with 'alternative facts' and sad thing is that people believe it because they are not inclined to check with us. We'd tell them things like this: currently we have publications on our website in 887 languages, and that, although the source material is English, the translations are tailored to the territory where they will be used. The translators have the readers in mind. Sometimes an entire publication is directed to a specific group.


____
"Where your treasure is, there your heart will be also."—Matthew 6:21.

[nanceebgd46]

I must say, that was one of the weirdest  articles I have ever read.  I am convinced

they aren't in the business of doing research on the subject matter they'll be writing about...because

around 90% of that article's information was pure disinformation... unadulterated nonsense, balderdash,

gibberish and rubbish.....who were the people they were referencing...it didn't sound like Jehovah's

Witnesses.

[Thesauron]

I must say, that was one of the weirdest  articles I have ever read.  I am convinced
they aren't in the business of doing research on the subject matter they'll be writing about...because
around 90% of that article's information was pure disinformation... unadulterated nonsense, balderdash,
gibberish and rubbish.....who were the people they were referencing...it didn't sound like Jehovah's
Witnesses.

I know. Sometimes you come across stuff like this, and you start to wonder where this "dr" got his degree from, and if he has no pride in finding accurate sources.


____
"Where your treasure is, there your heart will be also."—Matthew 6:21.

[GeordieGirl]

If I was searching for the truth and came across that article, it certanly wouldn't draw me to Jehovah, just the opposite in fact.  I would think, 'Glad I'm not involved with them.  They're just weird. Why would anyone want to be one of them'  

[GeordieGirl]

11 hours ago, jwhess said:

When I was younger, all of our big District and International Assemblies (yes we called them assemblies) had a rooming department.  Many weeks before the assembly date, the brothers would canvass the neighborhoods looking for rooms to house the attendees.  The last time that I shared in that type of lodging was the year after I was married, in 1971 in Jackson, Michigan (USA).  The convention was held at an outdoor race-track.  A nice older couple had guest rooms in their basement.  They never said much to us after we first met them, but each night when we would return to their home, they would look up from the TV and say,  "WE saw your meeting on the news tonight."  Staying in the private homes of worldly people would be too much of a risk for them and us today.

 

EDIT:  a side point, my future wife and her parents and siblings were just starting to attend meetings.  They traveled several hundred miles to attend an assembly in Buffalo. New York (middle 1960's).  They followed another witness family who had five in their group.  The rooming department had  arranged a private home for them.  When they finally got there, there was a mistake.  The home-owner thought the request was for TWO people.  He got TWO families.  To say that it was crowded is an understatement  (sleeping on the front porch, etc).  Ah, the memories.

 

Thank you for that information, brother John.  That was before my time in the truth and I don't know if they actually did that here .... though we did have our convention at an outdoor racetrack up until 1993.  It does just show though, how old some of his information is. Makes one wonder if he is actually an apostate, using information he knew about from decades ago.  

[New World Explorer]

13 hours ago, Thesauron said:

 

I read this article from The Christian Post, and this Dr. William Wagner confused me a bit, so perhaps one of you might enlighten me a bit, if possible.

 

http://www.christianpost.com/news/how-do-religions-grow-jehovahs-witness-a-strict-taskmaster-part-3-7-176550/

 

He writes:

Has anyone heard of, or tried, this?

 

 

What does this mean? Do we not try all sorts of methods?

 

(The Christian Post is a non-denominational evangelical newspaper based in Washington, D.C.)

 

 

____

"Where your treasure is, there your heart will be also."—Matthew 6:21.

 

How can we become “shrewd” and identify hoaxes, urban legends, swindles, and other misinformation that may appear on our computer screens? First, ask yourself: ‘Is the item from an official, reliable website or from a blog or an unknown source? Has it already been exposed on anti-hoax websites?’ Then, use “good sense.” (Prov. 7:7) If a news item seems unbelievable, it probably is. Furthermore, when the information discredits others, think about who would benefit from such news being spread and whether the source has ulterior motives in spreading it.

W15 10/15

[Raven]

Quote

In some areas they will put small marks on the doors to designate to other JW's that they have been there.

Quote

In one way they have not perfected a Mega strategy — they use the internet but all their material is the same as the printed material. They have failed to try to influence their society by looking at other means and methods.

Never heard of actually marking doors before, lol ~ Doesn't fit with what we are taught either. I'm going to assume, especially considering the rest of the content of that article, that it's an outright lie. It's possible that they want people to think we will vandalize their property when we visit..

The closest thing I know of is in some rural areas, where there are lots of houses on one street but very long driveways. They might leave a small, leafy branch by the driveway entrance to show that someone is currently visiting that house, and they remove it when they leave. It's nice and discrete ~ you have to be looking for it to notice.

 

Regarding the second quote, obviously they haven't spent much time at all on our official website, as we know there are tons of extra content other than the digital versions of our printed material.

I'm wondering if these other "means and methods" that they have in mind are things like getting involved in politics? If so, that's something we won't do, as we want to remain obedient and loyal to Jesus (John 15:19). Otherwise, not sure what else they have in mind?