Native Americans vs. Evolution

[Dustparticle]

When I was a kid, I was taught in school that our ancestors carried clubs in their hands and they were apes too. As I grow older I came too find out that some of my ancestors were Native Americans and they carried Tomahawks in their hands. Also it is believed that my GGGG grandfather was an Indian Scout too. So, us Native Americans is a strong proof that humans didn't came from apes with clubs in their hands, with no brains and being stupid as we are taught. Several of our ancestors had axes in their hands, had a brain and smart too..

[Miss Bea]

Sorry, the title of this is insulting. Something that I wouldn’t pay attention to, let alone articulate. 

[EccentricM]

Well, according to evolution, "ape ancestors" are far, far further back then the Native Americans. So it would be a very poor argument with 0 substance. It would be like me saying "My ancient ancestors were English Knights with swords, and so evolution is wrong". 

 

A lot more to it than that  

[Old]

2 hours ago, Miss Bea said:

Sorry, the title of this is insulting. Something that I wouldn’t pay attention to, let alone articulate. 

I too question this topic. What kind of mind connects Native Americans with evolution? Even evolutionist make no such connection. If my ancestor was an Indian scout I would never bring it up in polite conversation. I suggest the OP read"Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee" by Dee Brown and then reexamine his post.

[tekmantwo]

Interesting topic Brother Dustparticle, I'm curious, what moved you to start it?.

 

My sister did some research and discovered that we (us kids) are related to Gen Custer. I'm not proud of that but, it is history,  an undeniable fact.

 

When you say that about your GGGG, do you mean that he scouted for the Army, or that he scouted for his Indian Nation? That is an interesting bit of history for your family. .it will be neat  to talk with him when he gets back.  

 

I don't really believe that this would be a good argument against the evolution believers,  the span of time you mention wouldn't be long enough for any real evolutionary change to happen,  they believe that it takes many millions,  or billions, of years for changes to occur.  

 

[Pjdriver]

5 hours ago, Dustparticle said:

When I was a kid, I was taught in school that our ancestors carried clubs in their hands and they were apes too. As I grow older I came too find out that some of my ancestors were Native Americans and they carried Tomahawks in their hands. Also it is believed that my GGGG grandfather was an Indian Scout too. So, us Native Americans is a strong proof that humans didn't came from apes with clubs in their hands, with no brains and being stupid as we are taught. Several of our ancestors had axes in their hands, had a brain and smart too..

Hi Glen, I thought maybe you were kidding around. Everyone else took it seriously. Now I’m not sure. 

I am sure many of our ancestors at some point walked around with clubs, but most likely spears trying to catch their next meal. But, the ape part is science fiction.

Now a days many of my family members have been seen walking into clubs.  they have been known to monkey around.

 

PS. By the way...when I die I’m going to donate my body to science fiction.  

[Qapla]

My Dad used to say that some of his ancestors may have swung by their necks but none of them ever swung by their tails.

Edited February 7, 2018 by Qapla

[EccentricM]

10 hours ago, Miss Bea said:

Sorry, the title of this is insulting. Something that I wouldn’t pay attention to, let alone articulate. 

 

8 hours ago, Old said:

I too question this topic. What kind of mind connects Native Americans with evolution? Even evolutionist make no such connection. If my ancestor was an Indian scout I would never bring it up in polite conversation. I suggest the OP read"Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee" by Dee Brown and then reexamine his post.

 

"With all humility and mildness, with patience, putting up with one another in love,  earnestly endeavoring to maintain the oneness of the spirit in the uniting bond of peace" - Ephesians 4:2-3

“Let a rotten word not come out of your mouth, but only what is good for building up.” - Ephesians 4:29.

[Miss Bea]

2 hours ago, EccentricM said:

 

 

"With all humility and mildness, with patience, putting up with one another in love,  earnestly endeavoring to maintain the oneness of the spirit in the uniting bond of peace" - Ephesians 4:2-3

“Let a rotten word not come out of your mouth, but only what is good for building up.” - Ephesians 4:29.

Sorry, some times one has to speak up. Some things are just not okay. We all have a right to express ourself. In kindness, yes, but, as brother Glen has the right express himself, I, too have that right. We just differ, and the right to express that difference is a part of a member of a group such as this. We take, and we give.  But, we still love and respect one another. 

 

[EccentricM]

6 minutes ago, Miss Bea said:

Sorry, some times one has to speak up. Some things are just not okay. We all have a right to express ourself. In kindness, yes, but, as brother Glen has the right express himself, I, too have that right. We just differ, and the right to express that difference is a part of a member of a group such as this. We take, and we give.  But, we still love and respect one another. 

 

 

Oh of course. I just felt it came off as a bit.. mean or harsh to the OP as perhaps they are not as well versed or educated in the topic of evolution, and it looked as if people were calling them stupid and not worth their time rather than kindly explaining and educating why their argument was not one that could be used against evolution.  

Edited February 7, 2018 by EccentricM

[Miss Bea]

10 minutes ago, EccentricM said:

 

Oh of course. I just felt it came off as a bit.. mean or harsh to the OP as perhaps they are not as well versed or educated in the topic of evolution, and it looked as if people were calling them stupid and not worth their time rather than kindly explaining and educating why their argument was not one that could be used against evolution.  

 

Thank you, brother. I appreciate your kindness and caring. I may have come off as harsh. I did not feel harsh. Just, well as I said, insulted. I do thank you, and realize I should have handled this in a more private manner. I guess when one is actually exposed to some things, it’s more personal. Won’t it be grand when none of us will be wounded, and respond, sometimes from those wounds?

Brother Glen, I am sorry and did not mean to be harsh. 

[EccentricM]

1 minute ago, Miss Bea said:

Thank you, brother. I appreciate your kindness and caring. I may have come off as harsh. I did not feel harsh. Just, well as I said, insulted

 

Sa'll good. Why were you insulted if you don't mind me asking? Very personal? Are you, or do you have connections or family ties to Native Americans?  Or insulted from an educational perspective and experience in that field and so can get frustrated at things like that?

[Dustparticle]

 I'm sorry that there is some misunderstanding here. I do not believe to insulting anyone at all!! In my area, when I was young we was taught that our ancestors carried a club looking stupid and were apes!! My attention was no matter what background we have with an ax, spear, club, that we are NOT STUPID AND WE ARE NOT APES!! Yes, I put a little humor in this because I have read a lot of books of my background that we are savages or animals and that was my whole point.. With some of my ancestors being a Native American, others view them like animals and I personally know this. I might add, that I relative to others with different backgrounds and races and others know me as being lovable to all. Yes, some of my ancestors carried other instruments in their hands too.

 

 Here is one reminder, not everything begin with with a club. Genesis 4:22  Also, Zilʹlah gave birth to Tuʹbal-cain, who forged every sort of tool of copper and iron.

 

 Much Blessings to all.

 

 

 

 

[EccentricM]

52 minutes ago, Dustparticle said:

 I'm sorry that there is some misunderstanding here. I do not believe to insulting anyone at all!! In my area, when I was young we was taught that our ancestors carried a club looking stupid and were apes!! My attention was no matter what background we have with an ax, spear, club, that we are NOT STUPID AND WE ARE NOT APES!! Yes, I put a little humor in this because I have read a lot of books of my background that we are savages or animals and that was my whole point.. With some of my ancestors being a Native American, others view them like animals and I personally know this. I might add, that I relative to others with different backgrounds and races and others know me as being lovable to all. Yes, some of my ancestors carried other instruments in their hands too.

 

 Here is one reminder, not everything begin with with a club. Genesis 4:22  Also, Zilʹlah gave birth to Tuʹbal-cain, who forged every sort of tool of copper and iron.

 

 Much Blessings to all.

 

 

 

 

 

I think the confusion you might have here is... the term "ancestor". Ancestor means many generations back, and is not limited to a direct lineage or time span. Adam and Eve are our ancestors for example.

 

To break down the basics.. Evolution does not teach native Americans were stupid or ape men, they acknowledge their existence and intelligence in history. Whether they used axes or clubs would not matter. The two subjects are unrelated. They may teach ape men were people with clubs, but that has nothing to do with the history of Native Americans. 

 

The saying that native Americans were "savages" and "animals" was referring to their behaviour, way of life and so on, as opposed to it being a reference to evolution, ape men or development of human intelligence or bodies.  

 

 

Evolution teaches that there were first animals that were ancestors of apes and men, and this ancestor lead to both branches of apes and mankind, and along the way of this progression you get "ape men" who were considered "the cave men with clubs" and then they later evolved into full on humans who are superior to them, and then begins ancient history of man as we know it, from Africa and so on where "humans as we know them today" began, and later down the line came the native Americans who are considered by evolutionists to be full humans and intelligent, not animals and not at all in any relation to any teaching of ape men. Evolution and Native Americans being "savage" have nothing to do with each other what so ever, so saying that NA's were actually not savages, does nothing to argue against evolution.  

 

For example, your argument is like me saying "people said my granddad was an idiot and acted like an animal, but I have proof now he was smart, he used to build watches! So.. evolution is not true, we did not come from apes!" So where I'm getting at? 

 

I think you have taken the description of "our ancestors" from your evolution teachers a bit too narrow, to the meaning of "your" ancestors, your personal past family generation.

 

But when evolutionists say "ancestors" they mean waaaay further back, before any of our "family ancestors" as we know them (such as your ancestors of NAs) even existed.  I feel that you are trying to say "evolution taught me my ancestors looked like apes and used clubs, but I know they were Native Americans with axes and were not ape like, but were smart". You have gotten mixed up in the definitions and context of "ancestors" that they were actually referring to. 

 

When evolutionists say "ape men ancestors" they do not refer to any of the human cultures that we know in history, whether it be Native Americans, Anglo Saxons and so on.

 

It would be accurate for me to say, some of our earliest ancestors were foul and savage people and then point to Noah's day and how the early human family were all evil. But this does not relate at all to my recent family ancestors, grandmother, great, great grand mother and so on.  

 

Evolutionists terminology of "ape men ancestors with clubs" does not = "our human ancestors, previous family generations & cultures".

 

 

 

I 'hope' that makes sense  

 

 

Edited February 7, 2018 by EccentricM

[Dustparticle]

 I talk to a brother on this and agreed pretty much what I said because he is black and Native American too One reminder: I was taught a Cave Man was an Ape Man. But, that is not true! Many human beings have lived in caves for 6,000 years. With clubs or axes a Cave Man is a Human Being and not an Ape!!!