Peace and Security, Great Tribulation, Armageddon

[LeolaRootStew]

11 minutes ago, Bible_Schulz said:

I am looking for the article where ist says that we will not preach a judgement message!

 

any ideas?

 

 

their stance is that we may or may not preach a hailstone message. I don't remember them ever saying we will definitively not preach a judgement message, unless you mean we will keep preaching the good news (of the end) which is technically a judgement message for the wicked.

[LeslieDean]

18 minutes ago, Bible_Schulz said:

I am looking for the article where ist says that we will not preach a judgement message!

 

any ideas?

 

August 2025 “Questions From Readers” in The Watchtower
A more recent article discusses when the preaching work will end and clarifies that the good news of the Kingdom will continue to be preached right up until Armageddon, rather than being replaced entirely by a doom-and-gloom judgment message. This is an adjustment of earlier understanding and shows the Society’s current stance on the timing of any judgment-focused message.

[Doug]

36 minutes ago, LeslieDean said:

August 2025 “Questions From Readers” in The Watchtower
A more recent article discusses when the preaching work will end and clarifies that the good news of the Kingdom will continue to be preached right up until Armageddon, This is an adjustment of earlier understanding and shows the Society’s current stance on the timing of any judgment-focused message.

 

Context is very important here.  This is during a tribulation such as has never occurred before, and will be cut short lest no one should survive.

In the midst of that, the good news will continue to be preached.  Some, possibly many, will join us. No doubt the celestial phenomenon will help open their eyes. But the vast majority will view the good news message as delusional rubbish.

Whatever the people decide, they will have had every possible opportunity to take sides with Jehovah and live.

[LeslieDean]

2 hours ago, Doug said:

 

Context is very important here.  This is during a tribulation such as has never occurred before, and will be cut short lest no one should survive.

In the midst of that, the good news will continue to be preached.  Some, possibly many, will join us. No doubt the celestial phenomenon will help open their eyes. But the vast majority will view the good news message as delusional rubbish.

Whatever the people decide, they will have had every possible opportunity to take sides with Jehovah and live.

Isn't that what it says?

[Doug]

2 hours ago, LeslieDean said:

Isn't that what it says?

 

Hi Leslie. Well, it said the good news will be preached to the last hour.  But it didn't elaborate on the circumstances. 

We can use our imagination.  The good news will be a lifeline that people can grab if they have some understanding, some awareness, of what's really going on.  But the vast majority will be overwhelmed with the problems related to the great tribulation and take no note of the opportunity they have.

 

And, while the current understanding is that the good news will be preached until Armageddon, we don't know how that message will be delivered.

I wasn't contradicting anything you posted, I was just embellishing on it.  Thank you for your post.

[Bible_Schulz]

Thanks!

 

Preaching the good news to the end means for me not preaching a hailstone/jugdement message.

 

I wonder if there was a status with that topic in it.

[Bruceq]

Look in the index under Great Tribulation there is an excellent chronological timeline. In that timeline during the Great Tribulation after Babylon the Great is destroyed it states:

preaching “good news of the Kingdom” (Mt 24:14) a hailstorm for God’s enemies (Re 16:21] w25.08 31; w20.05 15; w19.10 16; rr 66, 198; w15 7/15 16; w08 7/15 7; re 234

 

In other words the preaching we do will be good news to those who accept it and a judgement to those who do not. So it depends on their response to the good news we preach at that time. It will become more hard-hitting as the tribulation continues forcing everyone to either accept the Kingdom [good news] or not [adverse judgement]. [Annual Meeting]

[Shawnster]

33 minutes ago, Bible_Schulz said:

Thanks!

 

Preaching the good news to the end means for me not preaching a hailstone/jugdement message.

 

That's because you are a sheep. 

 

(2 Corinthians 2:15) 15 For to God we are a sweet fragrance of Christ among those who are being saved and among those who are perishing; 16 to the latter ones an odor of death leading to death, to the former ones a fragrance of life leading to life. And who is adequately qualified for these things?

https://www.jw.org/finder?wtlocale=E&pub=nwtsty&srctype=wol&bible=47002016&srcid=share

 

 

*** w05 9/1 p. 31 Let Jehovah’s “Saying” Safeguard You ***

Because God’s people cleave to the Bible and share its comforting message with others, they diffuse an incenselike “sweet odor” of life that gives pleasure to Jehovah. But to unrighteous individuals, the bearers of that message emit, according to the J. B. Phillips’ translation, “the deathly smell of doom.” Yes, the figurative sense of smell of the wicked has been so distorted by Satan’s system of things that they feel uncomfortable or even hostile in the presence of those diffusing the “sweet odor of Christ.” On the other hand, those zealously spreading the good news become “a sweet odor of Christ among those who are being saved.” (2 Corinthians 2:14-16) Such honesthearted ones are often disgusted with the hypocrisy and religious lies that characterize false religion. Thus, when we open God’s Word and share with them the Kingdom message, they feel drawn to Christ and want to learn more.—John 6:44.

https://www.jw.org/finder?wtlocale=E&docid=2005646&srctype=wol&srcid=share&par=22

 

Our current understanding of the hailstone message is basically the same. Those opposed to the truth will feel our message is hard-hitting judgment, a condemnation of this system of things. 

[Eejay]

3 minutes ago, Shawnster said:

Our current understanding of the hailstone message is basically the same. Those opposed to the truth will feel our message is hard-hitting judgment, a condemnation of this system of things. 

Acts 7:57 The reaction the Sanhedrin to the message. It hit them pretty hard.

[Bible_Schulz]

Yes Bro Bruce. That is correct and the August 2025 “Questions From Readers” are telling us exact the same indeed. Thanks

 

IMHO the following to sentences (w Aug 25) say that we will not preach an extra message:

"Previously, we understood that we would stop preaching the good news when the great tribulation began..." and "Thus, we will continue to preach the good news until just before that final end."

 

In 2022 we still believed that there would be an extra message:

"During the great tribulation, the final judgment message will become more hard-hitting" (watchtower 2022, May Page 7 Vers 19)

 

 

same in w 2023 July page 2 vers 3

"How will we respond if we are asked to preach a hard-hitting judgment message and unbelievers oppose us"

This all indicates to me, that we all beleived in the past, that we have to preach an extra judgement message. 

 

I have to review the broadcast and status videos to find the passage. 

Edited 20 hours ago by Bible_Schulz

[Shawnster]

48 minutes ago, Eejay said:

Acts 7:57 The reaction the Sanhedrin to the message. It hit them pretty hard.

Excellent example 

[LeolaRootStew]

2 hours ago, Bible_Schulz said:

Yes Bro Bruce. That is correct and the August 2025 “Questions From Readers” are telling us exact the same indeed. Thanks

 

IMHO the following to sentences (w Aug 25) say that we will not preach an extra message:

"Previously, we understood that we would stop preaching the good news when the great tribulation began..." and "Thus, we will continue to preach the good news until just before that final end."

 

In 2022 we still believed that there would be an extra message:

"During the great tribulation, the final judgment message will become more hard-hitting" (watchtower 2022, May Page 7 Vers 19)

 

 

same in w 2023 July page 2 vers 3

"How will we respond if we are asked to preach a hard-hitting judgment message and unbelievers oppose us"

This all indicates to me, that we all beleived in the past, that we have to preach an extra judgement message. 

 

I have to review the broadcast and status videos to find the passage. 

 

Are you under the impression that preaching the good news will be easier than preaching a hailstone message? 

 

If the message is something like, "Soon God will destroy all His enemies" or "Soon God will destroy all wickedness and those who support it", can you see how the vast majority of people who are opposing God would see that good news as "hard-hitting"?

 

It's not an "extra" message in that it is not a new topic, but it will hit the ungodly like a hailstone in a way that it does not in our current day because the words don't apply to them yet.

 

Whatever we label it, it will no doubt not be received well by the vast majority who hear it.

Edited 17 hours ago by LeolaRootStew

[Lance]

Interesting the issue of Greenland and Europe/Nato… how the UN will be involved with all this… interesting times.

[feebee]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-15473067/Donald-Trump-Britain-tariffs-Greenland-deal-buy-territory.html

 

We trust Bible prophecy that the Anglo American WP won't become the "American WP", but it sure seems that the USA is isolating itself.

[feebee]

https://www.afr.com/world/north-america/broad-mandate-of-trump-s-board-of-peace-sets-it-up-as-rival-to-un-20260118-p5nuui

 

Trump's "Board of Peace" - a rival to the United Nations? 

[SteveAus]

Interesting take on the US current stance. From a CNN interview with White House aide Stephen Miller

 

 

Quote

“The United States of America is running Venezuela. By definition that’s true,” Donald Trump’s deputy chief of staff, Stephen Miller, said in a notable CNN interview last week.

 

“You can talk all you want about international niceties and everything else, but we live in a world – in the real world – that is governed by strength, that is governed by force, that is governed by power. These are the iron laws of the world since the beginning of time.”

 

Miller’s quote resonated because it encapsulated something analysts and commentators have described about the second Trump administration but which is rarely articulated explicitly by an official.

 

Under Trump 2.0, the so-called norms of the rules-based order – working through global institutions and frameworks, co-ordinating with allies, respecting the “niceties” that Miller mentioned – are being tossed aside in favour of raw power and brute strength, both military and economic.

 

Edited 15 hours ago by SteveAus

[trottigy]

56 minutes ago, feebee said:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-15473067/Donald-Trump-Britain-tariffs-Greenland-deal-buy-territory.html

 

We trust Bible prophecy that the Anglo American WP won't become the "American WP", but it sure seems that the USA is isolating itself.

 

That's the interesting part about American politics, eh? It only last 2-4 years. It is entirely possible that Republicans loose at least one house in the next election, less than a year away, and all the current craziness will turn into different craziness. And regardless of that, in less than 3 years Trump won't be President. He will get lost to history as all past Presidents have done.

Edited 14 hours ago by trottigy

[Doug]

3 hours ago, LeolaRootStew said:

 

If the message is something like, "Soon God will destroy all His enemies" or "Soon God will destroy all wickedness and those who support it", can you see how the vast majority of people who are opposing God would see that good news as "hard-hitting"?

 

Whatever we label it, it will no doubt not be received well by the vast majority who hear it.

 

 

The following statements come from our special edition of the Watchtower ~ An End to War, How?

 

God will end human governments by means of what the Bible calls the war of Armageddon.

God will replace human governments with his Kingdom.

God's Kingdom will destroy the instigators of war, Satan and his demons.

God's Kingdom will remove wicked people who refuse to stop fighting or disrupting the peace of others.

 

It's hard to imagine a message more blunt, more hard-hitting, than the above.  But it very well may be.

[Michał]

In the past we believed we will STOP preaching good news (enabling people to repent) and we’ll START preaching bad news (judgment message) without any hope to the recipients.

 

Now, we understand it better that the good news is BOTH good news and bad news (depending on recipients reaction) so there’s no need for any extra judgement message because it’s already in the good news „packet”. 
 

I like the example of smell. For me blue cheese has a divine smell but my kids run away from it like from fire. 

[myvalk]

On 6/28/2022 at 8:00 AM, carlos said:

Daniel, we alI understand your feelings. We all get discouraged sometimes. But the truth is that no human knows when the end will come. The Governing Body does not know any better than us. They just study Bible prophecies and see how they are being fulfilled by world events, the same as we all do. So whether they use the word "imminent" or "the last of the last days", or whether they have conventions and Memorials planned for several years, that's irrelevant. It doesn't mean anything. It's not a clue as to the time of Armageddon. They will keep planning conventions and buildings and projects and one day the end will come and some of those projects will not take place, or will take place in the new world.

 

Then why do they keep saying it's imminent? Because that's their job. Not to give us clues for the date of Armageddon, but to remind us to keep awake and serve with a sense of urgency. Christians need a sense of urgency in order to be spiritually strong, if we lose that sense of urgency we quickly become discouraged, lose our zeal and let other things take priority in our life. Whether the end is coming next week or it will take some years yet, we need to be busy in spiritual activities, that's the only way to conquer the world.

 

But isn't that cheating, to tell us the end is imminent when they really don't know how far it is? No, it's not. First, because world conditions are changing very quickly and the end feels very close. And secondly, because the "end" is not necessarily Armageddon. I could have an accident this afternoon, or a heart attack, or be a victim of violence, and die. Here I am speaking of weeks or months or years, when actually I only have a few hours left to serve Jehovah to the best of my ability. So the wise approach is to keep planning and doing our best for Jehovah with a sense of urgency and soon the end will come and all promises will become a reality.

And THIS is why I love reading Carlos’ comments. 💕👍🏻

[jwzhang]

Trump creates his own UN: countries must pay US$1bn to join his "Board of Peace" – Bloomberg 

 

Uhhh... is this just a phase of his? 😅😅

Jehovah will need to step in soon for this lunacy 🙏

[Tronora]

@jwzhang Didn't read what you posted before I posted. Interesting!

 

- - -

Suddenly I get the feeling we are so close! (I'm not usually on that bandwagon   )

 

When I read Rev 16:13

 

"And I saw three unclean inspired expressions that looked like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon and out of the mouth of the wild beast (not scarlet) and out of the mouth of the false prophet."

 

(Not out of the mouth of the scarlet beast!) Out of the false prophet's mouth!

 

I got the idea (last night) that what if the false prophet at some point actually no longer will be a part of the scarlet beast? That it operates independently? Current circumstances could suddenly make that a probability. 

 

And that's when I thought we could be very close   This speculation has not been carefully examined by me. I may come back to this some other day. 

 

Has anyone else thought about the role of the false prophet? Independent or just part of something?

 

(My content was written while jwzhang posted)

Edited 5 hours ago by Tronora

[Shawnster]

1 hour ago, jwzhang said:

Trump creates his own UN: countries must pay US$1bn to join his "Board of Peace" – Bloomberg 

 

Uhhh... is this just a phase of his? 😅😅

Jehovah will need to step in soon for this lunacy 🙏

 

Or it turn out to be hot air. 

[Shawnster]

1 hour ago, Tronora said:

I got the idea (last night) that what if the false prophet at some point actually no longer will be a part of the scarlet beast? That it operates independently? Current circumstances could suddenly make that a probability

 

Well, the US was never a member of the League of Nations, so there is precedent for the US (or any other country) to not be a member. 

 

 

[JennyM]

10 hours ago, trottigy said:

 

That's the interesting part about American politics, eh? It only last 2-4 years. It is entirely possible that Republicans loose at least one house in the next election, less than a year away, and all the current craziness will turn into different craziness. And regardless of that, in less than 3 years Trump won't be President. He will get lost to history as all past Presidents have done.

Maybe Trump could  fulfill prophecy, if that so, then we are 2-4 yrs close to Armageddon..