UN has denounced Vatican

[trottigy]

I listened to some of this this morning - http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/president-obama-national-prayer-breakfast-article-1.1604182

 

The connection between the US Govt and Religion is still VERY strong.

 

He is a good speaker, its just the follow through - ONLY God's Kingdom can bring about true freedom! So, I don't blame President Obama for not being to make it happen  

[zoebarry]

I listened to some of this this morning - http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/president-obama-national-prayer-breakfast-article-1.1604182

 

The connection between the US Govt and Religion is still VERY strong.

 

He is a good speaker, its just the follow through - ONLY God's Kingdom can bring about true freedom! So, I don't blame President Obama for not being to make it happen  

 

 

Perhaps that's why the sudden destruction of BTG will come as a SURPRISE!!

[Trina]

I know, the pictures placed with the articles I have seen show the Pope having a scowl on his face and defending himself, but saying that the UN is interfering in the church, because not only was this denouncing about the abuse but also on lack of insurance provisions due to their beliefs, which the Pope felt was the intrusive portion of the findings. But they are requesting action from the church, the problem is that the Pope is signed into the UN as a member, and because of this they are being placed in charge of much of the peace making process, right in the middle actually. I look at this as the perfect setup for the governments to turn against these religions who will never get along. So next we look for complete destruction of the religions which I saw on here an article about an organization named Pave The Way Foundation, who have written to Ban Ki Moon the Secretary General of the UN and is requesting the establishment of a specific council to call out false religions(in those specific terms)which they described as any religion that involves itself in wars, or violence in the name of their religion.

If they set this counsel up, as Jehovah's people we will really stick out as just about the only religion that does not participate in violent actions. Wouldn't that be right in line with bible prophecy being named by the UN council as false religious organization? Any thoughts?

[timpin]

the rep i saw for the pope on bbc news was talkin about these cases as ancient history .. how the vatican has put many things in place now... i think its only a decade or go... and thats the cases we know about. ive got underpants older than that... everyone will see how fithy they are... the vatican i mean... not my pants!

speaking about dirty underwear   ... http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/02/05/un-committ...    ...   got a feeling this will go back and forth a bit as it escalates!   ...  [friends a word of caution: Please keep in mind the cover series of our Dec. 2013 Awake and this weeks upcoming Study article also regarding the media!]  

Edited February 6, 2014 by timpin

[Mykyl]

Use it to remind us where we are in the stream of time. That is what I try and do. It is interesting from the point of view of who the players are of course.

 

Regarding speculation the following magazine made this point :- http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/pc/r1/lp-e/2001083/0/0

"...“The end of all things has drawn close.” How close? There is no way for humans to pinpoint the exact day and hour. (Matthew 24:36) But there is a difference between indulging in speculation, which the Bible does not encourage, and keeping in expectation of the end, which it does encourage. (Compare 2 Timothy 4:3, 4; Titus 3:9.) What is one way that we can keep in expectation of the end? It is by paying close attention to the evidence that the end is near."

[Roselyn]

The destruction of Babylon the Great begins with Christendom so it seems significant to me that the UN is targeting the Vatican.

[LeslieDean]

The destruction of Babylon the Great begins with Christendom so it seems significant to me that the UN is targeting the Vatican.

That's true! There are so many things that keep us in suspenseful expectation it us much like watching an excellent ping-pong match with amplified sound effects! Ewwwww!!!! Ahhhhh!!! Ohhhhhhh!!!! Jehovah really knows how to fulfill His own prophecy! Keeping us on the edge of our seats with 'with plenty of excitement and uttered 'Wow! I didn't see that coming!'

[Trina]

Been talking with some of the brothers and sisters sharing research and would like to share here.

Please look at the WT study article 6/15, 2012 pages 14-18 paragraph 17 of the article entitled: Jehovah Reveals What Must Shortly Take place.

Soon Jehovah will cause the political elements of Satan's system, as represented by the United Nations, to attack false religion. (This is the part that shows what the destruction means) They will destroy her influence and devastate her riches. Such an event may have seemed unlikely just decades ago.

Another sister told me to review closely what the New York Times wrote from SNAP representative Ms. Dorris of St. Louis of the UN denouncement..."It is wonderful that the UN has spoken so clearly about what the vatican has done - and what it has failed to do, to us, it is a call for the CIVIL AUTHORITIES TO STEP IN. Church officials have proved they cannot police themselves."

Question to you brothers and sisters...is her destruction going to be exactly as has been written for us by the GB it is her influence and riches? Please let me know your thoughts on this, i guess when you think about it, if the harlot has no authority of influence, and she is broke, how could she operate, she would have to close doors the courts will take possession of her properties and money.

[Robroy]

i guess when you think about it, if the harlot has no authority of influence, and she is broke, how could she operate, she would have to close doors the courts will take possession of her properties and money.

Two things this reminds me of:

1. I read a news report a few years ago about how much wealth the Catholic Church has and how much it brings in annually. It was written very well and obviously researched deeply. However, as the author stated, the Vatican is extremely secretive about their riches so it was almost impossible to verify their point with hard facts.

The bottom line was, all the billions that they have paid out in the last few decades was just a drop in the bucket of the wealth they have and what they bring in each year easily would cover it. If this is true about her riches, I would think that it would take an awful long time for her to go broke. She will be, as Revelation says, stripped of her wealth. Otherwise we'd be waiting decades for her to go belly up.

2. Although not written about in the Bible, when the Roman armies returned to Jerusalem in 70ce, it is reported by Josephus that General Titus commanded his troops not to destroy the temple, just the city. The temple was accidentally set on fire by one of his troops. Wouldn't that be interesting if something like this happened this time. The intention of the U.N. to not destroy Christendom and then Babylon the Great, but somehow, "accidentally", destroying her. This could be how the commercial and political element bewail the fact she is gone. Of course, all this is just guesses, but interesting, none the less.

[Roselyn]

Seems to me that the various governments could certainly use the vast riches the Vatican has. We don't know what 'thought' Jehovah will put into the UN's heart to destroy her, but they'll sure benefit from the money, temporarily of course ~

[trottigy]

Seems to me that the various governments could certainly use the vast riches the Vatican has. We don't know what 'thought' Jehovah will put into the UN's heart to destroy her, but they'll sure benefit from the money, temporarily of course ~

 

Yes, as the next chapter (Rev 18) shows:

 

 

9 “And the kings of the earth who committed sexual immorality* with her and lived with her in shameless luxury will weep and beat themselves in grief over her when they see the smoke from her burning. 10 They will stand at a distance because of their fear of her torment and say: ‘Too bad, too bad, you great city,+Babylon you strong city, because in one hour your judgment has arrived!’

11 “Also, the merchants of the earth are weeping and mourning over her, because there is no one to buy their full cargo anymore, 12 a full cargo of gold, silver, precious stones, pearls, fine linen, purple cloth, silk, and scarlet cloth; and everything made from scented wood; and every sort of object made from ivory, and from precious wood, copper, iron, and marble; 13 also cinnamon, Indian spice, incense, perfumed oil, frankincense, wine, olive oil, fine flour, wheat, cattle, sheep, horses, carriages, slaves, and human lives.* 14 Yes, the fine fruit that you*desired has left you, and all the delicacies and the splendid things have vanished from you, never to be found again.

15 “The merchants who sold these things, who became rich from her, will stand at a distance because of their fear of her torment and will weep and mourn,16 saying: ‘Too bad, too bad, the great city, clothed with fine linen, purple, and scarlet and richly adorned with gold ornaments, precious stones, and pearls,+17 because in one hour such great riches have been devastated!’

“And every ship captain and every seafaring person and sailors and all those who make a living by the sea stood at a distance 18 and cried out as they looked at the smoke from her burning and said: ‘What city is like the great city?’ 19 They threw dust on their heads and cried out, weeping and mourning, and said: ‘Too bad, too bad, the great city, in which all those who had ships at sea became rich from her wealth, because in one hour she has been devastated!’+

20 “Be glad over her, O heaven,+ also you holy ones+ and apostles and prophets, because God has pronounced his judgment on her in your behalf!”+

[Trina]

So true. It sure is interesting to watch the show, I can say that the announcement made was surprising and shocking and will continue to unfold before our eyes, Jehovah's will is being accomplished. Revelation the 18:5-8a For her sins have massed together clear up to heaven, and God has called her acts of injustice to mind. Repay her in the way she treated others, yes, pay her back double for the things she has done, in the cup she has mixed, mix a double portion for her. To the extent that she glorified herself and lived in shameless luxury, to that extent giver her torment and mourning. For she keeps saying in her heart:"I sit as queen, and I am not a widow, and I will never see mourning." That is why in one day her plagues come...

[LindaViktoria]

What about this then......?

The panel also found fault with some central church teachings and their impact on children's health, urging the Vatican to reconsider its stance on abortion and contraception, and encouraging it to tone down criticism of homosexuality in an attempt to reduce "social stigmatisation" and violence against gay youths and children raised by gay couples.

In a swift and terse response, the Vatican released a statement saying it would submit the findings "to a thorough study and examination" but did not appreciate being asked to change its position on issues it considered immutable.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/feb/05/vatican-un-committee-clerical-sex-abuse-scandal

[Sheila]

Sister Carina wrote......... I think the United Nations already has authority, especially since the vatican is a member.

 

My daughter and I were discussing this very thing the other day and after a bit of research found that the Vatican City and Holy See are two totally different entities.  The Holy See controls Vatican City - which is an actual separate state or country  whereas the Holy See is likened to being Ambassadors only.   (Figure that for confusing everyone.)

 

The Holy See / Vatican City is a member of the UN but only in an observation role.   Which to my mind  means as they are not actual members of the UN, they can be expelled at any time.   When the UN turns against religion, including the Holy See/Vatican, it wont be technically turning against one of its own members.

 

Check it out on "member states of the UN" on Wikipedia - there are a number of other observator states (eg Samoa) and that may be because they cant afford the huge annual fees etc the UN requires from member nations, although I could be wrong there. (I dont include the Vatican/Holy See in that remark)

Edited February 7, 2014 by Sheila

[Allabord4Jah]

Puerto Rico Probes Church Sex Abuse Allegations

2/7/14 | 3:02 PM ET

 

(ABC News)

 

Puerto Rico Probes Church Sex Abuse Allegations

 

Prosecutors in Puerto Rico are investigating six priests who face sex abuse allegations and have been expelled by church authorities from a diocese in one of the island's north coastal towns.   Government prosecutor Yolanda Pitino said Friday that she and other attorneys are interviewing several people who have accused the priests of sodomy, lewd acts and sexual harassment.

 

She said the Arecibo Diocese has provided prosecutors with information related to the six priests, but that they need more details.  "We are not satisfied with the information that the church gave us," Pitino said in a phone interview, adding that the diocese has not responded to requests for more information. 

 

The Diocese of Arecibo said in a statement that it is working with authorities and sharing information about the six priests that Bishop Daniel Fernandez expelled starting in 2011. "(We) reiterate our policy of zero tolerance against child abuse," the diocese stated.

Fernandez did not return a message for comment.

 

The case has caught the attention of officials with U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement's Homeland Security Investigations, who have requested information from the island's justice department, according to a person familiar with the matter who was not authorized to speak publicly about it.

 

Complicating the investigation is a separate sex abuse allegation that surfaced against Fernandez himself, which he has rejected.

"Clearly, it's revenge for the decisions I've taken since the moment I assumed leadership of the diocese, where the situation that I found was not the most positive," Fernandez said in a recent statement. "My conscience is at peace, because I know the accusation is false."

 

Roberto Gonzalez, the archbishop of San Juan, has said that the Holy See has requested information about the allegation against Fernandez, but that there is no official investigation.  Pitino said the investigation regarding the sex abuse allegations is just beginning.

"We are urging people to find the courage and go to police if they have been victims," she sai

[Allabord4Jah]

From The Huffpost Religious Section

 

 

The Pressure is On Pope Francis To Stamp Out Sex Abuse

 

Pope Francis Pressured By UN Report To Take Stronger Action On Catholic Priest Abuse

VATICAN CITY (AP) — Pope Francis came under new pressure Wednesday to punish bishops who covered up for pedophile priests when a U.N. human rights panel accused the Vatican of systematically protecting its reputation instead of looking out for the safety of children.

In a scathing report that thrilled victims and stunned the Vatican, the United Nations committee said the Holy See maintained a "code of silence" that enabled priests to sexually abuse tens of thousands of children worldwide over decades with impunity.

 

Among other things, the panel called on the Vatican to immediately remove all priests known or suspected to be child molesters, open its archives on abusers and the bishops who covered up for them, and turn the abuse cases over to law enforcement authorities for investigation and prosecution.

The committee largely brushed aside the Vatican's claims that it has already instituted new safeguards, and it accused the Roman Catholic Church of still harboring criminals.

 

"The committee is gravely concerned that the Holy See has not acknowledged the extent of the crimes committed, has not taken the necessary measures to address cases of child sexual abuse and to protect children, and has adopted policies and practices which have led to the continuation of the abuse by, and the impunity of, the perpetrators," the panel said.

 

The stinging language surprised the Vatican and put it in damage-control mode, with officials strongly defending the church and accusing the committee of allowing itself to be swayed by pro-gay ideologues. The Vatican, which defended itself at a U.N. committee hearing last month, said the panel ignored the measures the Holy See has already taken to protect children.

 

"I'm tempted to say that the text was probably written ahead of time," said the Vatican's U.N. ambassador, Archbishop Silvano Tomasi.

Nevertheless, the report puts pressure on Francis to take decisive action after a year in which he has largely let the abuse portfolio fall by the wayside as he tackled other pressing issues, such as reforming the Vatican bureaucracy.

 

The Vatican announced in December that the new pope would create a commission to study how to prevent abuse and help victims, but no firm details about its makeup or scope have been released since. And critically, the Vatican has yet to sanction any bishop for having covered up for an abusive priest, even though more than a decade has passed since the scandal exploded in the U.S. and countless law enforcement investigations around the world made it clear the role bishops played.

 

Vatican officials have suggested that under Francis, this might soon change.  The report was issued by the U.N. Committee on the Rights of the Child, an 18-member panel that includes academics, sociologists and child development specialists from around the globe.

Its job is to monitor compliance with the U.N. Convention on the Rights of the Child, a treaty the Vatican ratified in 1990. The treaty calls for signatories to protect children from harm. Only three countries have failed to ratify it: the U.S., Somalia and South Sudan.

 

Last month, the Vatican was subjected to a blistering daylong grilling by the U.N. committee, which then produced its final observations on Wednesday.  "The committee expresses serious concern that in dealing with child victims of different forms of abuse, the Holy See has systematically placed preservation of the reputation of the church and the alleged offender over the protection of child victims," the report concluded.

At a news conference in Geneva, committee chairwoman Kirsten Sandberg ticked off some of the core findings: that bishops moved pedophile priests from parish to parish rather than reporting them to police, that known abusers are still in contact with children, and that the Vatican has never required bishops to report abusers to police.

 

"This report gives hope to the hundreds of thousands of deeply wounded and still suffering clergy sex abuse victims across the world," said Barbara Blaine, president of the main U.S. victims group, SNAP.  "Now it's up to secular officials to follow the U.N.'s lead and step in to safeguard the vulnerable because Catholic officials are either incapable or unwilling to do so."  Critically, the committee rejected the Vatican's longstanding argument that it doesn't control bishops or their abusive priests.

 

The panel essentially held the Vatican responsible for every priest, parish and Catholic school in the world, calling on it to pay compensation to all victims of sexual abuse worldwide, and also to those who labored in Ireland's notorious Magdalene Laundries, the church-run workhouses where young women were subject to slave labor and often had their out-of-wedlock babies taken from them.

 

While the Vatican itself didn't raise an objection to that aspect of the report, other church advocates did. "I think that the U.N. report describes a monolithic church that does not exist in fact," said Nicholas Cafardi, a U.S. canon lawyer and former chairman of the U.S. bishops' lay review board that monitored clerical abuse. "The pope in Rome cannot control and is certainly not responsible for what happens throughout the Catholic world."   The committee disagreed.  Benyam Mezmur, a committee member and Ethiopian academic on children's legal rights, cited among other things a letter from a Vatican cardinal advising Irish bishops to refrain from any policy requiring they report pedophiles to police.

"They keep saying they don't have the authority, but in the meantime we have had instances of the Holy See trying to influence bishops," he said in an interview. "You cannot have it both ways. Either you have influence or you don't."

 

The committee's recommendations are non-binding and there is no enforcement mechanism. But it asked the Vatican to comply and report back by 2017.   The recommendations extended far beyond child sexual abuse in ways that conflict with church teachings.

For example, the committee urged the Vatican to amend canon law to allow abortions on children in some circumstances, such as to protect the life of the young mother. It asked the Holy See to ensure that sex education, including access to information about contraception, is mandatory in Catholic schools. And it called on the Vatican to condemn discrimination against homosexual children or youngsters raised by gay couples.

Tomasi accused the committee of adopting a pro-gay "ideological line."

[CHecker]

 

 

The connection between the US Govt and Religion is still VERY strong.

 

  

I just finished reviewing an article that I actually understood. This is the best article on the UN and the Catholic's I have ever seen. Explains how Catholics got into the UN, what maneuvers and schemes they used, how they use their influence to stay there so they can manipulate topics and people. This 22 page document was worth the read for me, I finally understand.

I realize others probably comprehend political jargon, or talk from religious groups but I have to admit I don't. So if you already know the information in this document it won't be news to you. But this was for me and I hope some others as well. 

http://www.catholicsforchoice.org/topics/politics/documents/CFC_See_Change_2013.pdf 

[sunshine]

The link doesn't work for me Cheryle, did you download it, if so could post or send it to me?

[CHecker]

Ya, I clicked on it and it didn't work for me either, weird,

 

Here it is again, I'll check it after posting to make sure it goes thru

 

http://www.catholicsforchoice.org/topics/politics/documents/CFC_See_Change_2013.pdf

 

 

OK, I checked it and it's going thru just fine.

Edited February 10, 2014 by bagwell1987

[Allabord4Jah]

Wasn't our WT yesterday GOOD?  I loved it.  So here we all are reading and picking up on what the Satan's world is up to.  Jehovah only wants us to stick with his source of material JW.ORG, the preaching work, our personal study, family studies, be at all the meetings (except when really sick or handicap, or in a nursing facility, home bound or what other circumstances in our lives) for those who can connect to their congregation hook up lines, participating, encouraging one another as the day draws near, and by the looks of things it is drawing nearer and nearer.   Seeing and reading these things that excite us, but in the long run, it is Jehovah's day, he will be the one to put it into their heart to turn on False Religion.  That's when the hatred that they have been building up all these years against religion will become evident and its total destruction.  So last week, the UN denounced the Vatican for not revealing and putting out of their mist their sex crazed priests, but remember they said they don't have to (Vatican) report till 2017.   These reports excite us, because we see the fruit trees blossom and we know the time is near.   Jehovah will deal with all of Satan's world and rid us of this monster once and for all time, him and his hordes -  Jehovah has made everything work for his purpose,  even the wicked for the day of disaster Prov 16:4

Edited February 10, 2014 by allabord4jah

[Trina]

I thought it might be fitting to suggest everyone read the Awake magazine 2000 10/22 page 31. Titled: Effort to oust the Vatican from the UN. You may remember this article but it has to do with the conflicting status of the Vatican in the UN to go along with the document that was uploaded. Makes complete sense after reading that article. States that the Vatican is the only religion that is in the mix of the largest government entity swaying major decisions they make for countries.

Anyway I hope you brothers and sisters have a wonderful week this week. I send my love to all.

[CHecker]

Trina

That's why I posted the article above. It's a very important article that gives details I've never realized before, going way back to the 1870 annexation of the Papal States, 1929 w/Mussilini agreement, and the 1933 description of what IS a state but what IS Vatican City. As well as the things you described above.

[Trina]

http://www.un.org/Overview/uninbrief/sc.shtml

Here is an interesting page on the authority of the UN through the security council in charge of peace and security. I guess it does not really matter if they are a country or not if there is a cause for concern in their opinion they can use force through several means including the military to produce peaceful resolutions that they decide through this council and there are only a few full members that can control the outcome for all. Interesting.

[timpin]

aaahhh why not!          ...   A pretty little girl named Suzy was standing on the pavement in front of her home. Next to her was a basket containing a number of tiny creatures; in her hand was a sign announcing FREE KITTENS. 

Suddenly a line of big black cars pulled up beside her. Out of the lead car stepped a grinning man. 

"Hello little girl, I'm the Pope. What do you have in the basket?" he asked. 

"Kittens," little Suzy said. 

"How old are they?" asked the man. 

Suzy replied, "They're so young, their eyes aren't even open yet." 

"And what kind of kittens are they?" 

"Catholic kittens," answered Suzy with a smile. 

the Pope was delighted. As soon as he returned to his car, he called his PR department and told them about the little girl and the kittens. 

Recognizing the perfect publicity opportunity, they agreed that the pope should return the next day; and in front of the assembled media, have the girl talk about her discerning kittens. 

So the next day, Suzy was again standing on the pavement with her basket of "FREE KITTENS," when the motorcade pulled up, this time followed by all the media. 

Cameras and audio equipment were quickly set up, then Pope got out of his car and walked over to little Suzy. 

"Hello, again," he said, "I'd love it if you would tell all my friends out there what kind of kittens you're giving away." 

"Yes sir," Suzy said. "They're Jehovah's Witnesses kittens." 

Taken by surprise, the Pope stammered, "But... but... yesterday, you told me they were Catholic." 

Little Suzy smiled and said, "I know. But today, they have their eyes open." 

[Kevin Anthony]

If you really want to get and feel the full import of these scandals that have been going on pretty much since the first and second Lateran councils began to enforce celebicy on the clergy, you need to watch "Deliver us from Evil", a documentary produced by PBS about one particular priest who had gotten away with this for over thirty years. It sickens a righteous person to know that these dioceses directly, and willfully moved men such as these from parish to parish as things got out of hand, with nery a slap on the wrist, until the situaltion was so fully out of control, there was no choice but to show worldly remorse. This is definitely part of the signs of this systems end.