conspiracy theories

[jps]

we are often reminded about the importance of rejecting them

 

what are the most common ones in your area?

 

asking for a friend

(😄)

[Tortuga]

I'm concerned that a list of conspiracy theories will turn into a heated discussion about which of them are really true.

Please ask your friend to be careful in what they ask for.

Edited June 17 by Tortuga

[Sheep]

19 minutes ago, Tortuga said:

I'm concerned that a list of conspiracy theories will turn into a heated discussion about which of them are really true.

Please ask your friend to be careful in what they ask for.

"Heated discussion" is right! Some people are just not willing to accept fact when there's a [better?] conspiracy theory to take its place! Even though it's only a "theory" some lean on it like it's the gospel truth. I hate that. (Evolution is also a theory, but non-believers prefer it to the truth.) Even in the congregation (although to a lesser extent), some brothers seem to lean one way or the other.

 

Even though I try not to follow the news in the USA, it seems Donald Trump is becoming a master at inventing conspiracy theories! The truth just doesn't fit his agenda.

 

 

( I hope this post isn't too political.)

[Mike047]

Probably best to close this thread before it goes any further.

[Frances Bennett]

I heard that the mods are trying to shut down people's right to free speech!

 

Hehe...only joking!

 

Seriously, even I think a thread like this will be too much hard work to moderate...and I love a conspiracy theory  fact 😉

 

[Tortuga]

55 minutes ago, Sheep said:

Even though I try not to follow the news in the USA, it seems Donald Trump is becoming a master at inventing conspiracy theories! The truth just doesn't fit his agenda.

I'm not naming names but I saw something in a public talk outline that I thought was worded very well, it said 

"Conduct once considered antisocial and wicked is now accepted as normal" I would add childish to that list.

[jps]

1 hour ago, Tortuga said:

I'm concerned that a list of conspiracy theories will turn into a heated discussion about which of them are really true.

Please ask your friend to be careful in what they ask for.

well 

lets keep it cool then 😄

 

since the term "conspiracy theory" is more or less synonymous with false/mis-/dis-/information in our publications, theres no room for such discussion; all conspiracy theories are false

 

i was just wondering what some of these (false of course) theories are..

[trottigy]

How about that the moon landing was faked. Here is an interesting spin on that:

 

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1896747/

 

Fly Me to the Moon - 

Quote

Marketing maven Kelly Jones wreaks havoc on launch director Cole Davis's already difficult task. When the White House deems the mission too important to fail, Jones is directed to stage a fake moon landing as back-up.

 

[Kwabena]

Let's see how long this thread will last before it's certain demise.

[Landon1285]

When the gap between those making changes and the reason behind them is large or unclear it becomes very tempting to want to bridge that gap. Therefore any attempt to discover the reasoning behind the change including the gap itself can come across largely conspiritorial.

 

This also includes what later comes out as being true whether forced out or not. 

 

I think that's the appeal of these theories and the hidden danger of making our personal opinion a universal standard. 

 

In my neighborhood the conspiracy theory is that every election is already decided. So rarely are we criticized for our politically neutral stance. 

[Kwabena]

12 minutes ago, trottigy said:

How about that the moon landing was faked. Here is an interesting spin on that:

 

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1896747/

 

Fly Me to the Moon - 

 

Neil Degrasse Tyson Explain if the moon landing was fake.

[Ishaya]

3 hours ago, jps said:

we are often reminded about the importance of rejecting them

 

what are the most common ones in your area?

 

asking for a friend

(😄

 

When I saw that expression in the last watchtower study ,I developed interest in knowing what it is all about and ways we can get involved with it,I have been checking the Internet to understand it better but i im still not making sense of it,

 

Can someone kindly enlighten me about what conspiracy theory is all about and ways it can occur in the congregation?

So far what I've been able to make of it is that it is "guesses" that go viral and and is almost taken to be true when it may probably not be true,for example I think a brother is dating a sister so I keep telling  brothers that Bro T and sis z are dating,is this what conspiracy theory is all about?

[computerwiz]

51 minutes ago, Ishaya said:

Can someone kindly enlighten me about what conspiracy theory is all about and ways it can occur in the congregation?

So far what I've been able to make of it is that it is "guesses" that go viral and and is almost taken to be true when it may probably not be true,for example I think a brother is dating a sister so I keep telling  brothers that Bro T and sis z are dating,is this what conspiracy theory is all about?

 

Conspiracy theories can be about all kinds of things, but generally revolve around the government.

 

The line of thinking to a conspiracy theory generally starts innocent & correct, but then gets to the extreme or bizarre.  One example is "chemtrails".

 

Line of thinking

-Government is corrupt (true)

-Government does things to control us (true - debt, laws, etc)

-Observation: Some plane trails disappear, some do not.

-Reasoning: There must be something different about the ones that do not.

-Conclusion: Government is afraid of losing control so subdues us with chemicals they spray in the air

 

From the reasoning onward, there's no evidence or made up "evidence".

 

Another is about drinking the blood of children.

 

Line of thinking

-Government is corrupt and therefore evil (one could agree since Satan is behind it)

-Government does black ops not only externally, but internally (true)

-Observation: A pedophile ring was found & disrupted by the US government.  No one beyond the managers were arrested.

-Reasoning: Those that used the ring are being blackmailed & manipulated by the government.

-Conclusion: All or most of those in higher positions must be pedophiles and therefore puppets of a deep state.  Including Hollywood.

-Further "facts" to hit your emotions: Different celebs make weird comments that could seem like code for such vile behavior.  Comments are then "decoded" to fit the conclusion.

 

Again, without evidence.  Some truth comes to light as time goes on, but then conspiracy theorists again take things to an extreme to say they are having satanic rituals & drinking the blood of children to stay young.

 

One last one is "flat earth" theory:

 

Line of thinking

-Satan is in charge of the earth (true - which is why this one might actually sound reasonable to JWs)

-Governments & organizations are merely his puppets (basically true)

-Satan would like nothing better than to erase God from our beliefs (true)

-Satan created NASA to turn mankind towards science and away from God (ehhh...)

-Observation (but wrong): The discoveries of NASA, such as the earth being round, go contrary to the Bible that describes the earth as a footstool (therefore flat) and the firmament story.

-Reasoning: Satan is using NASA, therefore anything "discovered" or taught by NASA must be a lie.

-Conclusion: The earth is flat.

 

 

There are many many theories out there.  Some are true (though the motives or explanations are way in left field), but most do not come true.  All are designed to make you mad and riled up about something.  And since we know this world is corrupt & Satan is behind many things, it is easy for us to say "wow yeah that must be true!" because almost all of them are about corruption and evil.  Even if true, there's nothing we can do about them, and nothing we can gain from studying them other than hating this system of things even more.  But I'd argue that could make it harder to love people and make disciples.    It can also compromise our political neutrality...  Indeed, we must be careful about such things.

[Tortuga]

A Conundrum is when the government tells the conspiracy theorist that space aliens do exist.

[Ishaya]

21 minutes ago, computerwiz said:

 

Conspiracy theories can be about all kinds of things, but generally revolve around the government.

 

The line of thinking to a conspiracy theory generally starts innocent & correct, but then gets to the extreme or bizarre.  One example is "chemtrails".

 

Line of thinking

-Government is corrupt (true)

-Government does things to control us (true - debt, laws, etc)

-Observation: Some plane trails disappear, some do not.

-Reasoning: There must be something different about the ones that do not.

-Conclusion: Government is afraid of losing control so subdues us with chemicals they spray in the air

 

From the reasoning onward, there's no evidence or made up "evidence".

 

Another is about drinking the blood of children.

 

Line of thinking

-Government is corrupt and therefore evil (one could agree since Satan is behind it)

-Government does black ops not only externally, but internally (true)

-Observation: A pedophile ring was found & disrupted by the US government.  No one beyond the managers were arrested.

-Reasoning: Those that used the ring are being blackmailed & manipulated by the government.

-Conclusion: All or most of those in higher positions must be pedophiles and therefore puppets of a deep state.  Including Hollywood.

-Further "facts" to hit your emotions: Different celebs make weird comments that could seem like code for such vile behavior.  Comments are then "decoded" to fit the conclusion.

 

Again, without evidence.  Some truth comes to light as time goes on, but then conspiracy theorists again take things to an extreme to say they are having satanic rituals & drinking the blood of children to stay young.

 

One last one is "flat earth" theory:

 

Line of thinking

-Satan is in charge of the earth (true - which is why this one might actually sound reasonable to JWs)

-Governments & organizations are merely his puppets (basically true)

-Satan would like nothing better than to erase God from our beliefs (true)

-Satan created NASA to turn mankind towards science and away from God (ehhh...)

-Observation (but wrong): The discoveries of NASA, such as the earth being round, go contrary to the Bible that describes the earth as a footstool (therefore flat) and the firmament story.

-Reasoning: Satan is using NASA, therefore anything "discovered" or taught by NASA must be a lie.

-Conclusion: The earth is flat.

 

 

There are many many theories out there.  Some are true (though the motives or explanations are way in left field), but most do not come true.  All are designed to make you mad and riled up about something.  And since we know this world is corrupt & Satan is behind many things, it is easy for us to say "wow yeah that must be true!" because almost all of them are about corruption and evil.  Even if true, there's nothing we can do about them, and nothing we can gain from studying them other than hating this system of things even more.  But I'd argue that could make it harder to love people and make disciples.    It can also compromise our political neutrality...  Indeed, we must be careful about such things.

 

Okay I'm getting it now,thanks very much.

But is conspiracy theory a deliberate attempt to misinform people or is it just an innocent assumption that gets taken seriously. 

Edited June 17 by Ishaya

[Kwabena]

2 minutes ago, Ishaya said:

 

Okay I'm getting it now,thanks very much.

But is conspiracy theory a deliberate attempt to misinform people or is it just an innocent assumption that gets taken seriously. 

Sometimes it's genuine, sometimes it's not.

[Ishaya]

1 minute ago, Kwabena said:

Sometimes it's genuine, sometimes it's not.

 

How do we get to know if it is genuine or not? Is it sometimes necessary to verify the theories?

 

[computerwiz]

Just now, Ishaya said:

But is conspiracy theory a deliberate attempt to misinform people or is it just an innocent assumption that gets taken seriously.

 

I get the feeling that its genuine most of the time, but the theorists get too absorbed into thinking everything is evil and corrupt that they start seeing it everywhere, without evidence.  I've had some conversations with some, and they can present plenty of "evidence" to try to convince you...which I think is more than you'd expect from someone simply trying to mislead you.  And that's what makes them so convincing.  They go very far to prove they're right.

 

But as soon as you provide counter proof, they start to shut you down just like the opposite side that they fuss at for doing that.  So then you do have to wonder if they're genuine?  Because at first they sound reasonable and logical, but then fail to continue a logical and reasonable discussion.

 

Hard to say, but I don't think it's deliberately trying to mislead people.  I just think they get caught up in their beliefs.

[computerwiz]

1 minute ago, Ishaya said:

How do we get to know if it is genuine or not?

 

Many things we will never know.  Not in this system.  We know it's corrupt.  That's all that really matters.  The evil details, if true, don't help convince us.  We're already convinced the world is wicked.  So why make ourselves sad trying to see if such corruption is true?

 

2 minutes ago, Ishaya said:

Is it sometimes necessary to verify the theories?

 

The only ones I feel worth looking into are health related.  Again, the theorist want to say that everyone is evil and out to get you.  But there are some things that do make sense to pay attention to.

 

For example, another conspiracy theory: Fluoride is a poison being used to make you dumber.  A very noteworthy fact is presented:

 

https://x.com/thehealthb0t/status/1655943268197347335

 

This is worth paying attention to.  This is something that you may want to change about yourself.  However, the IDEA that it is done ON PURPOSE to make people dumber is where we venture into conspiracy theory territory.  And the claim at the end that "it doesn't do a thing" is false.  It does, otherwise we wouldn't have it in the first place.  But again, now we're seeing dis-information being presented.  It started out good and reasonable, then it crosses over the line.  This is what happens time and time again with a conspiracy theory.

 

But because it started out reasonable, it makes you go "hmm....wonder what else I've been lied to about".  And with health related things, I think yes we need to do our own research and dig deeper.  Not just take everything for granted or at face value.  But again, conspiracy theorists will say all is being done on purpose, to hurt you, control you, to steal your money, etc.  So while paying attention is good, following their line of thinking is not.

[Qapla]

Here are a few that have even made it to JW Talk:

1. [REDACTED]                            
2.  
3. That the news about ....
4. ********************************

I know this is not a complete list, but I hope it helps get things started ~

[hatcheckgirl]

Last week’s WT study on “Press on to Maturity” had the link to this online article “Protect Yourself from Misinformation”.

 

What is a conspiracy theory? A conspiracy theory is a claim that sinister and powerful groups have secretly plotted to cause a significant or tragic event.

Why are they dangerous? Conspiracy theories can undermine trust in legitimate sources of information, and some can cause people to reject health or safety advice. Such theories can promote prejudice and violence against the group thought to be involved in the conspiracy.

Why are they so popular? Conspiracy theories increase in popularity during “periods of widespread anxiety, uncertainty, or hardship,” states the Encyclopaedia Britannica, such as “during wars and economic depressions and in the aftermath of natural disasters like tsunamis, earthquakes, and pandemics.” At such unsettling times, people accept conspiracy theories because these theories validate what they believe or help them to understand why bad things happen.

 

[carlos]

On 6/17/2024 at 10:11 PM, Ishaya said:

How do we get to know if it is genuine or not? Is it sometimes necessary to verify the theories?

 

Most conspiracy theories are false, but some might be true, at least to a degree. However, whether they are true or not is irrelevant. We know this world is in Satan's power and that all or most governments are corrupt, why waste our valuable time in researching how corrupt they are?

 

There was a demo at the circuit assembly last year. One brother was trying to send another a video about the government being involved in some disturbing business, something he had received from someone else. The second brother kindly declined. He didn't even question whether the news were true or false, he rather focused on how those stories make you feel: Do you feel spiritually strengthened and refreshed, or do you feel upset and disgusted? So why not spend time doing something that upbuilds you instead?

 

[Qapla]

[TheKid23]

When I was on the carts a few weeks ago a man came up to me and was telling me to be careful around the pigeons because they’re not really birds, they’re government spies keeping an eye on people 🙈 he was deadly serious too! 

[Frances Bennett]

11 minutes ago, TheKid23 said:

When I was on the carts a few weeks ago a man came up to me and was telling me to be careful around the pigeons because they’re not really birds, they’re government spies keeping an eye on people 🙈 he was deadly serious too! 

 

How Dare he! Birds...even pigeons...are almost too good to be true!

 

I came across this poem a while ago. I loved it...so no bird conspiracies please! 😆

 

The Loss of birds by Nan Craig

 

Of all the losses I think the loss of birds has been the hardest. Strangest.
Whole days pass, now, as
I struggle to explain them to you.

I begin: they were very light.
Light as lizards made of
wire and buttons. But
covered in tiny leaves,
leaves softer than the softest fur.
Shinier. Sleeker.
Suspiciously, you say: Fur-leaves?

Exactly, I say. Their legs
were little sticks. Snapped twigs.
The small ones anyway. The biggest ones
had feet like grappling hooks.
Their arms were half-furled
umbrellas. Elbows on backwards.
Stretching, they became sails
snapping in high winds.
Covered in those silky scales –
fur-leaves, you repeat – yes, I say – which lay flat like scales but ruffled sometimes in the breeze, like fur.

Fur but not, I say, again and again.

Their bones were hollow and they moved from ground to air to sky to speck faster than thought. They could not be caught, I lie: they moved too fast for human hands
or animals.

They listened carefully to everything,
but had no ears. (what? I really start to lose you here)
Their heads were round knobs
and one angry claw stuck out
the middle of their heads
for a mouth and they ate through the claw.
Sometimes a yellow claw. Sometimes black.
Thinking of ducks, I add: Sometimes the claw was blunt
like a thumb. It could be blue. Or red. Also, they birthed these little stones with goo and flesh inside, that you could crack and eat.

You listen to me but I understand
you don’t believe me, can’t believe me. How can you, I am raving,
nothing I say makes any sense.

They were everywhere, I insist. Everywhere.
You smile politely and begin to drift away.
WAIT! I shout. They also sang!

They sang.

At that point, I go silent,
seeing as by now
I don’t even believe myself.