Jump to content
JWTalk - Jehovah's Witnesses Online Community

Have Archaeologists Discovered the 'Signature' of a Biblical Prophet?


We lock topics that are over 365 days old, and the last reply made in this topic was 1658 days ago. If you want to discuss this subject, we prefer that you start a new topic.

Recommended Posts

A clay seal from the eighth century B.C. that was discovered in a Jerusalem excavation may bear the name of the biblical prophet Isaiah, according to a new article in Biblical Archaeology Review.
 
In the article, titled "Is This the Prophet Isaiah's Signature?," author and archaeologist Eilat Mazar suggests that the ancient Hebrew script impressed into the damaged half-inch oval of clay may have once read "Belonging to Isaiah the prophet."
 
If the interpretation of the lettering on the 2,700-year-old seal is correct, it would be the first reference to Isaiah outside of the Bible
 
Have Archaeologists Discovered the 'Signature' of a Biblical Prophet? (National Geographic)


Edited by Shawnster
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Thesauron said:

A clay seal from the eighth century B.C. that was discovered in a Jerusalem excavation may bear the name of the biblical prophet Isaiah, according to a new article in Biblical Archaeology Review.
 
In the article, titled "Is This the Prophet Isaiah's Signature?," author and archaeologist Eilat Mazar suggests that the ancient Hebrew script impressed into the damaged half-inch oval of clay may have once read "Belonging to Isaiah the prophet."
 
If the interpretation of the lettering on the 2,700-year-old seal is correct, it would be the first reference to Isaiah outside of the Bible
 
Have Archaeologists Discovered the 'Signature' of a Biblical Prophet? (National Geographic)

 

Interesting.:confused:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I should read the link.  Is there any reason or evidence to support it is the prophet Isaiah and not someone else? 

You’ll see the discussion in the article. The seal was found near the seal bearing the name of King Hezekiah. But it is incomplete. The usual expression is “Isaiah the prophet” (2Ki 20:11, 14 etc), but the seal only has part of the word ‘prophet’ and missing the definitive article, unless it was placed on a part of the missing piece. But it is an appealing thought.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Dages said:

NICE ! :infatuated:

 

Still, the specialists stay cool headed : it's not sure. Nice discovery though.


 

They will continue to stay coolheaded even if they find something to back up everything in the bible - oh right they already have ... they don't want to rewrite everything and don't want to say they are wrong - they will lose face.

 

This was very apparent in Patterns of Evidence - The Exodus - which has been proven through archealogy beyond a shadow of a doubt and they still say it's the ramblings of people under stress (ie: An Egyptian scribe wrote down in papyrus the 10 plagues as they happened and they still explained him as someone who was fantasizing). 

 

So yes Nice! For us - it's almost like Jehovah is letting evidence be found in copious amounts lately ... there is no denying Jehovah and his scriptures now - unless of course they stubbornly stand firm because of pride and we all know about undue pride.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Cool. 

 

But I notice something strange with the second picture. 

 

02-isaiah-seal-jerusalem.adapt.710.1.jpg

 

Quote

This clay bulla featuring the seal of King Hezekiah was found in the same excavation area, just 10 feet from where the 'Isaiah' seal was discovered.

 

 

Why would a Hebrew seal have pagan Egyptian symbols on it? Unless it was someone elses and was a "collective" of seals and signatures on one object for some other purpose. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, EccentricM said:

Cool. 

 

But I notice something strange with the second picture. 

 

02-isaiah-seal-jerusalem.adapt.710.1.jpg

 

 

Why would a Hebrew seal have pagan Egyptian symbols on it? Unless it was someone elses and was a "collective" of seals and signatures on one object for some other purpose. 

I read about that recently but can’t think where.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, EccentricM said:

Cool. 

 

But I notice something strange with the second picture. 

 

02-isaiah-seal-jerusalem.adapt.710.1.jpg

 

 

Why would a Hebrew seal have pagan Egyptian symbols on it? Unless it was someone elses and was a "collective" of seals and signatures on one object for some other purpose. 

Nice catch. The ankh and the winged creature (sun or scarab?) might have something to do with when “his heart became haughty”. (2Ch 32:25) 


Edited by Thesauron
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Thesauron said:

The ankh and the winged scarab might have something to do with when “his heart became haughty”. (2Ch 32:25) 

Good point. I was trying to remember if he ever went off course a bit, which would explain things. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Good point. I was trying to remember if he ever went off course a bit, which would explain things. 

The Hebrew University press release explains the iconography on the Ophel bulla and other seal impressions of Hezekiah:

 

The symbols on the seal impression from the Ophel suggest that they were made late in his life, when both the royal administrative authority and the king’s personal symbols changed from the winged scarab (dung beetle)—the symbol of power and rule that had been familiar throughout the ancient Near East, to that of the winged sun—a motif that proclaimed God’s protection, which gave the regime its legitimacy and power, also widespread throughout the ancient Near East and used by the Assyrian kings.

 

This change most likely reflected both the Assyrian influence and Hezekiah’s desire to emphasize his political sovereignty, and Hezekiah’s own profound awareness of the powerful patronage given his reign by the God of Israel. While the changed Royal administrative symbol imprinted on the King’s jars used the motif of a sun with wings extended to the sides, Hezekiah’s personal changed symbol had a sun with sheltering wings turned down and a life-symbol at the end of each wing. This special addition of the symbol of life may support the assumption that the change on the King’s personal seal was made after Hezekiah had recovered from the life-threatening illness of shehin (II Kings 20:1-8), when the life-symbol became especially significant for him (ca. 704 BCE).

 

http://new.huji.ac.il/en/article/28173

 

https://www.biblicalarchaeology.org/daily/biblical-sites-places/jerusalem/king-hezekiah-in-the-bible-royal-seal-of-hezekiah-comes-to-light/

Link to comment
Share on other sites

In Hezekiah's time both Egypt and Assyria were world powers and their influence was widespread in all the Middle East. I remember seeing at the Louvre Museum some Phoenician sarcophagi that mimicked the Egyptian ones, only more modest.

 

So my guess is that maybe those symbols were not used with religious connotations but they were widespread symbols to represent royal power in international protocol. A bit like drugstores are identified in many countries with a lit up green cross. It doesn't have anything to do with the religious symbol of the cross, although probably in its origin it did.


Edited by carlos
Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 hours ago, ChrisC said:

I read about that recently but can’t think where.

 

“Why a Jewish king would have pagan symbols on his seal is another matter: some assume it is because he was de facto a vassal king on behalf of the Assyrians.”

https://jwtalk.net/forums/topic/34221-bible-is-right-again-chief-of-the-city/

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, carlos said:

A bit like drugstores are identified in many countries with a lit up green cross. It doesn't have anything to do with the religious symbol of the cross, although probably in its origin it did.


 

2

Interesting, here a green cross signifies a marijuana store. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

No one mentioned this, but if this is legitimate, it would be much more than a proof of Isaiah's existence during Hezekiah's day.   There are many Bible scholars that say that Isaiah's prophecy was actually written by two or more people, particularly because he wrote prophecies that were fulfilled after Hezekiah, which would establish a legitimate prophecy that was written BEFORE it was fulfilled. 

 

https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2010161#h=10:0-10:508

https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/pc/r1/lp-e/1200272967/91/4


Edited by rbrown1205
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 2/22/2018 at 1:30 PM, Stormswift said:

They will continue to stay coolheaded even if they find something to back up everything in the bible - oh right they already have ... they don't want to rewrite everything and don't want to say they are wrong - they will lose face.

 

This was very apparent in Patterns of Evidence - The Exodus - which has been proven through archealogy beyond a shadow of a doubt and they still say it's the ramblings of people under stress (ie: An Egyptian scribe wrote down in papyrus the 10 plagues as they happened and they still explained him as someone who was fantasizing). 

 

So yes Nice! For us - it's almost like Jehovah is letting evidence be found in copious amounts lately ... there is no denying Jehovah and his scriptures now - unless of course they stubbornly stand firm because of pride and we all know about undue pride.

Not only that- the Egyptians SAW those ten plagues, but Pharaoh still chased after them!!  And THEN, a month after the Red Sea parted and saved them with Moses' God-given leadership, the Israelites were ready to make up their own idol and get rid of Moses!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

This seal was discovered in 2009, so why are they reporting publicly about it now? This City of David/Ophel area has highly charged political connotations as it is on disputed land between Palestinians & Israelis, so one wonders if this has any bearing on Middle Eastern politics as to the reason why it has been reported now. 

https://robertcargill.com/2015/12/03/some-questions-about-the-recent-news-of-the-discovery-of-a-seal-bearing-the-name-of-king-hezekiah-in-jerusalem/

http://www.middleeasteye.net/columns/israel-cant-use-archaeology-justify-colonialism-and-dispossession-1987013836

 

There's also been a lot of previous attribution of bulla/seals to Biblical characters such as Jehoash and Baruch that have either been exposed as fakes (like the James Ossuary fake) or badly dated Mediaeval pilgrim souvenir badges named to Biblical characters or wrongly identified or bulla of people in Jerusalem who just happened to have the same name as a Bible character. 

 

Pictures of this seal vary and sometimes media attribute it to Hezekiah and other times it's said to be Isaiah's or a different one is depicted in different newspaper articles, so when the reporting is so vague or suspect we do well to suspend judgement. There are better things to authenticate Isaiah.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This seal was discovered in 2009, so why are they reporting publicly about it now? This City of David/Ophel area has highly charged political connotations as it is on disputed land between Palestinians & Israelis, so one wonders if this has any bearing on Middle Eastern politics as to the reason why it has been reported now. 
https://robertcargill.com/2015/12/03/some-questions-about-the-recent-news-of-the-discovery-of-a-seal-bearing-the-name-of-king-hezekiah-in-jerusalem/
http://www.middleeasteye.net/columns/israel-cant-use-archaeology-justify-colonialism-and-dispossession-1987013836
 
There's also been a lot of previous attribution of bulla/seals to Biblical characters such as Jehoash and Baruch that have either been exposed as fakes (like the James Ossuary fake) or badly dated Mediaeval pilgrim souvenir badges named to Biblical characters or wrongly identified or bulla of people in Jerusalem who just happened to have the same name as a Bible character. 
 
Pictures of this seal vary and sometimes media attribute it to Hezekiah and other times it's said to be Isaiah's or a different one is depicted in different newspaper articles, so when the reporting is so vague or suspect we do well to suspend judgement. There are better things to authenticate Isaiah.

You might want to read the article again. It was not about the Hezekiah seal, which was found some time ago. Also, bullae of his have been found earlier. They started to appear on the antiques market in the mid-90s. None have been revealed as fakes. The bullae found that are attributed to Hezekiah have a number of different designs.

The Baruch bullae was mentioned by both the Watchtower and Awake! some time ago.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.

About JWTalk.net - Jehovah's Witnesses Online Community

Since 2006, JWTalk has proved to be a well-moderated online community for real Jehovah's Witnesses on the web. However, our community is not an official website of Jehovah's Witnesses. It is not endorsed, sponsored, or maintained by any legal entity used by Jehovah's Witnesses. We are a pro-JW community maintained by brothers and sisters around the world. We expect all community members to be active publishers in their congregations, therefore, please do not apply for membership if you are not currently one of Jehovah's Witnesses.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.

JWTalk 22.7.20 (changelog)