2025 GB Update #5 - Putting to rest issues on “Higher” Education

[Dages]

18 minutes ago, Violin said:

I think they live in a more liberal state like California

Putin nuke on California when ?  

[Dages]

4 minutes ago, Cushi said:

If tattoos weren't permanent

Skin decals  Feel like a kid but it should be fine  

[Cushi]

2 minutes ago, Dages said:

Skin decals  Feel like a kid but it should be fine  

😆 I remember when those were popular here in the states. Kids would buy them in tattoo vending machines.

[Dages]

14 minutes ago, Cushi said:

😆 I remember when those were popular here in the states. Kids would buy them in tattoo vending machines.

Yeah, they were popular in the 90s here  

[Tortuga]

47 minutes ago, Violin said:

I think they live in a more liberal state like California. 

Is it your opinion that California is more spiritually liberal?

That's not a very encouraging thing to share.

 

[MM9106]

“Eternal Happiness” is an incredible theme for a convention. Very excited to see which countries and cities will have international conventions. 

[Ross92]

17 hours ago, sfossy said:

It has never been an impediment in the first place, as the experience of many can testify.

 

What's really new in this update is that brothers who choose to pursue additional education are given practical suggestions to stay spiritually healthy rather than being left to navigate the dangers by themselves.

Yes, it really was. Certainly in the UK. The Shepherd book makes it quite clear as well that an appointed brother whose wife or children go to university ought to have his spiritual qualifications reconsidered. From a personal point of view, just staying on to study A Levels at school caused issues for the body of elders when it came to my privileges. It depends which part of the world you’re in. 

[Jwanon]

7 hours ago, Buckeye said:

I don’t think this is a misunderstanding on my part or my local elders, it was an unwritten rule

 

Many people here said they went to college while appointed. I went to college too

[Amygdala]

2 hours ago, Julsey said:

It was the same way in Scotland when I attended university there. No condemnation from anyone in the congregation. I felt so loved! When I came back to the States, though, I sometimes wondered if most of the congregation had me marked for doing something as awful as attending university (yes, I’m being sarcastic), as I was rarely included in anything. We certainly had enough remarks made in talks over the years that made me feel like I was some kind of lowlife. 😞

Hugs to you dear sis. When you think of Job, think of how his fellow brothers in the faith completely misjudged him. Eliphaz, Bildad and Zophar totally misjudged Job and his situation, labelling him, trying to make up some story or sin that he supposedly was guilty of, and trying to break him down during his worst moments in his life.
 

All of them were later reproved for their wrong thinking, but we can just imagine how hurtful this was coming from his own brothers in the faith. About Job:

Quote

*** w95 2/15 pp. 27-28 A Lesson in How to Handle Problems ***

His three companions further disheartened Job by voicing personal ideas rather than godly wisdom. Eliphaz went so far as to say that ‘God has no faith in his servants’ and that it did not really matter to Jehovah whether Job was righteous or not. (Job 4:18; 22:2, 3) It is hard to imagine a more discouraging—or more untruthful—remark than that! Not surprisingly, Jehovah later rebuked Eliphaz and his companions for this blasphemy. “You men have not spoken concerning me what is truthful,” he said. (Job 42:7) But the most damaging assertion was yet to come.

Eliphaz finally went to the extreme of making outright accusations. Since he was unable to extract from Job an admission of guilt, he resorted to fabricating sins that he assumed Job must have committed.

The focus the last few recent morning worships and the moving last talk on Friday of the convention "What does Jesus see in you?” is addressing when such low feelings come up and that Jehovah and Jesus see the truth about a person.
 

The focus is changing, and now it is to ensure that such injustices don’t get over-weighed by how Jehovah and Jesus really feel about a faithful brother or sister. Because labelling is easy for humans to do. 

[Robinson]

13 hours ago, ChrisW said:

I think this clarification is for those that judge those harshly for pursuing additional education.

Yes. I often times kept quiet about my education and where I worked because of the judgy comments I got. The elders sent the CO to me for deciding to go to a local university. instead of regular pioneering. I know many pioneers who went to a university and kept it under cover due to the judgement

[Andress]

8 hours ago, Buckeye said:

You say things haven’t changed, but you also say in the past it was discouraged.  Well as of today it’s officially no longer discouraged. I wouldn’t do something Jehovah or his organization discourages. Why was it discouraged in the past when i wanted to go and why isn’t it discouraged now? What changed?  And to the friends saying you were always allowed, you’re allowed to do anything but there are consequences for them.  In my case i was allowed to go to university but the consequence was my dad would have had to step down from being an elder.  In others case the consequence was “just” that they had to feel guilty about going but still went.  I don’t think this is a misunderstanding on my part or my local elders, it was an unwritten rule. It is discussed in a negative way throughout the literature and has been viewed that way for decades now.  It will not be anymore. Things changed

true brother… but, i belive the advise was good 15-20 years ago. We always teach how to put gods kingdom first in many areas. As i see it , the organisation only adapts. Today you can not survive as a window cleaner and have tim for 90h of pioneering time.
So we have reduced it to 50h, and understand that just to get a ordinary job we need to have additionsl education in many areas. The world have changed and so do we. I though think this adjusted recommendationcould had come 10 years earlier , we started to face this issue in europe already then, but not before.

[Dolce vita]

2 hours ago, MM9106 said:

“Eternal Happiness” is an incredible theme for a convention. Very excited to see which countries and cities will have international conventions. 

A theme perhaps based on the Sermon on the Mount and its various joys...

[Andress]

3 hours ago, Dages said:

Skin decals  Feel like a kid but it should be fine  

Yes,,, but this is actually our view point. No forbidding, but be wise…

 

https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/questions/bible-say-about-tattoos/
 

The problem is the old generation of elders, whom tends to read these type of articles and thinks ”then i will not have even a small tatoo on my ancle… it is a sin”… but did the article say that ? No

[WilliamChew]

 

2025 GB Update #5 transcript

 

Spoiler

2025 GB Update #5.pdf

2025 GB Update #5.docx

2025 GB Update #5.epub

 

[Michał]

10 minutes ago, Dolce vita said:

A theme perhaps based on the Sermon on the Mount and its various joys...

Yes, I was thinking of „Wisdom from the gospels” but „Eternal happiness” is much better!

[Knight]

14 hours ago, Jwanon said:

 

 

They were never forbidden by the organization. It's individuals who have confused warning with proscription. 

 

The videos are telling the responsible brothers to stop imposing rules that the organization never gave. 

I don't agree. They were warnings, not proscriptions, true, but there were also clear rules given by the organization for those who were considered exemplary. With beards you were not considered an exemplary brother and in most countries you couldn't have special privileges. If you were pursuing higher education your situation had to be evaluated by the elders and in some cases your requirements as an appointed brother/sister were reviewed and you could also be removed. These were not rules set by the elders, by clear directions coming from the local Branches and instructions by the organization. 

14 hours ago, Jwanon said:

 

I feel like it's the opposite

 

Everything that has been discussed lately has always been personnal decisions

 

But reading the comments here, some among our brothers have imposed additional rules in the congregations

 

So the GB has to clarify our stance by telling all of us explicitly that we must not judge our fellow believers for things that are not proscribed in the Bible, and giving specific examples (beards, secular education, toasting, etc)

 

So we can't be trusted to follow Bible principles on our own unless we get explicit "permission" from the Organization. And that is normal, because we are imperfect so Jehovah gives us clear direction until we mature, just like he did for the Israelites. Because at the present, we have not matured enough and probably won't be until the start of the Great Tribulation 

 

Again, I feel that now there is more trust in our ability to make wise decisions. They were personal decisions but they were more monitored by the elders; now it is different. 

 

P.S. yes toasting was not proscribed in the Bible, but it was in our publications:

https://www.jw.org/en/library/magazines/w20070215/Questions-From-Readers/#:~:text=The Bible does not mention toasting%2C so why do Jehovah’s Witnesses avoid sharing in toasts%3F

Edited 23 hours ago by Knight
Typo

[MullumMiss]

9 hours ago, Buckeye said:

You say things haven’t changed, but you also say in the past it was discouraged.  

 

In my case i was allowed to go to university but the consequence was my dad would have had to step down from being an elder.  

So this update neither discourages nor encourages further education.  It stresses as it has always been it is a personal decision.  

I was in a congregation in the early 2000s and one of our elders had a son who went to university and he did not step down.  

[Andrey]

Dear brothers and sisters, I want to share with you a thought that I heard in a speech by a circuit elder about our fears and worries. There are many things in our lives that we have gone through as servants of Jehovah. But Satan can play on our negative feelings and reminders. He can remind us of the past, which can torment us and slow us down from moving forward, to the New World.

 

So, here is the thought: "If Satan reminds you of your past and it slows you down in some way, remind him of his future!"

[Luigi62]

1 minute ago, Andrey said:

So, here is the thought: "If Satan reminds you of your past and it slows you down in some way, remind him of his future!"

 

So true!

[blanchard]

Question concerning "GB #5: is it important, is it a problem of faith ? Before or after my faith concerning Jehovah, the ranson and other importants doctrines is the same. And tomorow pov others changements will come concerning other aspect pehaps fest, anniversary ... but our faith will be the same

[Jwanon]

1 hour ago, Knight said:

there were also clear rules given by the organization for those who were considered exemplary

 

Show me the publication that said that a brother cannot be examplary if they had a beard or if they were attending college please

Edited 22 hours ago by Jwanon

[blanchard]

32 minutes ago, Jwanon said:

Show me the publication that said that a brother cannot be examplary if they had a beard or if they were attending college please

There are clear rules and strong unwritten suggestions

[Andrey]

A very good idea is mentioned in this article:

 

*** w25.07 p. 16 par. 7 Can You Still Learn From Basic Bible Teachings? ***
7 Rahela, who lives in Slovenia, has found that thinking about her Creator has helped her to accept a change in organizational direction. She admits: “Sometimes, it hasn’t been easy for me to accept decisions made by those who take the lead. For example, even after I watched the 2023 Governing Body Update #8, I was shocked the first time I saw a bearded brother giving a talk. So I prayed to Jehovah to help me adapt to this change.” Rahela recognized that as the Creator of heaven and earth, Jehovah is perfectly capable of guiding his organization in the right direction. If you find it hard to adjust to a new understanding or to accept new direction, why not humbly meditate on the superior wisdom and power of our Creator?—Rom. 11:33-36.
https://www.jw.org/finder?wtlocale=E&docid=2025486&srctype=wol&srcid=share&par=14

 

*** w25.07 pp. 18-19 par. 17 Can You Still Learn From Basic Bible Teachings? ***
17 As Jehovah’s Witnesses, we are thrilled when our understanding of a Scriptural truth is clarified. Yet, we are also deeply grateful for the fundamental Bible teachings that drew us to the truth in the first place. If we are ever tempted to insist on our own opinion rather than to submit to guidance from Jehovah’s organization, we can humbly remember who is directing that organization—the almighty and all-wise Creator. When we or a loved one is enduring a trial, we can be patient and reflect on why Jehovah has allowed suffering. And when deciding where to focus our time and resources, we can recall the urgency of these last days. May Jehovah’s reminders continue to strengthen us, motivate us, and make us wise.
https://www.jw.org/finder?wtlocale=E&docid=2025486&srctype=wol&srcid=share&par=27

[OW90]

3 minutes ago, blanchard said:

There are clear rules and strong unwritten suggestions

Thank you. It can't be spun some other way.

[Jwanon]

19 minutes ago, blanchard said:

There are clear rules and strong unwritten suggestions

 

Well it it's unwritten then it's not a "clear rule"

 

I'm asking for evidence that the organization ever suggested that brothers with beards or who go to college cannot be examplary, brcause I have known several cases where this did not happen