Jehovah's Witnesses could get $1 billion for NYC properties

[GStorrs46]

  I have two questions that some may know the answer to. Is there any conflict interest in that the factories etc. were

sold to relatives of Donald Trump ( said to be his son - law ). Second, The figure that I read about the price paid was

somewhere in the realm of 350 million dollars. The sum for the rest of the properties ( around one billion ). Why such a

difference ? Is there that much many more properties than the previous sale ? Have there been that much rise in property

values > Just curious. My question I have with regard to Donald's Trump's relatives is the feeling that it is sad after it has

served such a sacred purpose for so many years, It would go to those whose reputations are much  seen as promoting

all of the wealth and showy things of this world, even as John spoke against. Any comments

 

GStorrs46

[rocket]

That''s more than two questions and your last is not a question.

I know of many Kingdom Halls that were sold to Christendom's churches. No conflict because once sold it is no longer dedicated to Jehovah.

[Nobody]

We sold our Kingdom Hall to a Baptist group. No issues.

[Hope]

That''s more than two questions and your last is not a question.

I know of many Kingdom Halls that were sold to Christendom's churches. No conflict because once sold it is no longer dedicated to Jehovah.

 

A Kingdom Hall I attended as a teen (so many great memories!) and the Assembly Hall I was baptized in (a beautiful old theater, like a mini-Stanley Theatre) were both sold to churches.  It looks obscene... but, we've moved on and they're just buildings, after all.

[GStorrs46]

First the comment to the my question was actually more than two. If you look closely there are actually just two. The rest is

follow up commentary to make my questions more understandable. I appreciate the comments from those whose Kingdom

Halls / Assembly Hall have been sold and many time bought by other churches. I guess part of that is the nature of this

old system. But part of my question came from reading they were turning part of the former factory building into high end

boutiques and luxtury apartments. I understand from their standpoint why they would. But it just seems so sad, and both an

irony and mockery of buildings once used to show the world the vanity of where such life styles would eventually lead it is now

used for that purpose.

  Then of course my second question dealt with the contrast in the price. Can any of you who are located in New York City

speak to the second as you may be more aware of the rise in real estate prices as well as the difference in the amount of

property they are talking about. Because the former sale appears to be about 1/3rd of the proposed current one. Thank you all

for your answers.

 

GStorrs46

[timpin]

That''s more than two questions and your last is not a question.

I know of many Kingdom Halls that were sold to Christendom's churches. No conflict because once sold it is no longer dedicated to Jehovah.

That's because you're reading from left to right, try rotating your screen - but he only used 2 ? marks! 

 

Timing - "SHOW ME THE MONEY" works here too as dedicated funds!

[Qapla]

First the comment to the my question was actually more than two. If you look closely there are actually just two. The rest is

follow up commentary to make my questions more understandable. I appreciate the comments from those whose Kingdom

Halls / Assembly Hall have been sold and many time bought by other churches. I guess part of that is the nature of this

old system. But part of my question came from reading they were turning part of the former factory building into high end

boutiques and luxury apartments. I understand from their standpoint why they would. But it just seems so sad, and both an

irony and mockery of buildings once used to show the world the vanity of where such life styles would eventually lead it is now

used for that purpose.

  Then of course my second question dealt with the contrast in the price. Can any of you who are located in New York City

speak to the second as you may be more aware of the rise in real estate prices as well as the difference in the amount of

property they are talking about. Because the former sale appears to be about 1/3rd of the proposed current one. Thank you all

for your answers.

 

GStorrs46

 

Why is it any "sadder" or "more ironic" or any more of a "mockery" then a Building that was once used to dispense the Truth and be the only place of Clean Worship" in the community to now be used by Babylon the Great to dispense their filth -- as is the case with those Kingdom Halls and Assembly Halls that have been sold.

 

As was the case with "The Holy Land", once Jehovah is finished using something and let's it go, it is no longer to be viewed as a "Special Possession" - and any use it goes on to have has absolutely NO reflection of HIM or His Organization.

[Hope]

It's sentiment ruling here....

[Shawnster]

It's sentiment ruling here....

 

And not just here

[GStorrs46]

Perhaps so. But as the place the produced the very literature that caused my family to come into the truth, and nurished

us and so many others down through the years I was just expressing my personal feelings. This is not meant to cause a big

issue or controversy over the subject. In fact Jehovah helped me to some to personal peace with situation. But it is much

like Biblical sites once closely associated with his worship, that have been corrupted. As you say and Jesus said, it is neither

in Jerusalem or Samaria that we worship the Father, for we worship in spirit and in truth.

    As for the money difference, I was just wondering whether the actual  headquarters buildings equaled close to 2/3rd more 

in property value. or perhaps represented Jehovah's blessing on their sale. One follow up question, will they be retaining any

of the originally historical buildings, like 124 Columbia Heights ?

 

GStorrs46

[Nobody]

I understand Michael, some things touch us individually more than others. When we pass the old KH that we sold, I think about how so many wonderful things happened to me their.  I gave the last JW part in the building also, so I will always have that memory.

 

But I also think about how much money was received in exchange for ownership and how it was used to bring glory and honor to Jehovah in the form a beautiful new Kingdom Hall in a more prominent location.  

 

As far as price difference it's probably due to the ability to multi purpose the sites. 

 

And they are all being sold.

[GStorrs46]

Randy,

 

   I thank you for your comments. They are much appreciated. For me it is not only the role they played in providing the spiritual

food we have received over the years. But their history going all the way back to Brother Russell. And I think of the number of

trips we made as a family. These are all precious memories ands unique to each one. Like the time we met old Bro. Papa-

George in the old Squibb building. He was one of the anointed and had the opportunity of showing the old Photo-Drama of

Creation. I have other very special memories besides that.( We toured Bethel in 1971, 1975, 1982, 1985, 1995, and 2005 )

So we saw quite a progression over the years. However the last time we went, due to how bad conditions were getting in NYC,

I began to feel it was time for a move. So I understand the decision on many fronts. Yet when we see the old buildings at the

foot of Brooklyn Bridge, and in Columbia Heights, like you there will always be a wave of nostalgia and sadness sweep over

us, knowing they helped promote the worship of our wonderful God Jehovah, for many years. And all the hard work done there

by dedicated brothers who did so out of love, and not for a salary.

 

GStorrs46

[Qapla]

I completely understand. I have known many who served in Brooklyn although I never got the chance to visit there.

 

In addition, I can appreciate the feelings because the Hall I was raised in, was first appointed an Elder in and was married in - is now being used by BTG.

[GStorrs46]

   Thanks John,

 

I my minds eye I cam visualize so much of what we saw and learned on those visits, as well as charming brothers

and sisters who took us on tours, and answered our many questions. Like on our last trip the sister who took us on tour

through the residence building across from the four building factory complex. Since this was 2005 and the 9 / 11

attack was still fresh on everyone's mind. we were asking her how ones at Bethel reacted and dealt with it. She said

for some it was much harder. Then she told of her husband who had his office in the 25 Columbia Heights Building.

She said he watched with binoculars everything happening out his office window. She then just said quietly, "That

was a mistake. " I think the now increased threat of terrorism is one of the many strong arguments for moving our

headquarters out of Brooklyn. I'm sure many a parent will breath with a bit of relief. So it's not I don't see the wisdom of

the move, but since we are human, we also have our own precious memories tied to it too.

 

GStorrs46

[shali]

Just tie those memories to the people from now on rather than the buildings. We are all going to lose people and places dear to us at Armageddon, suppose we should start getting used to it now.

[GStorrs46]

Briggett,

 

   Thanks for the thought. I don't tie the memory of that sister to the buildings, other than  that is where we met her. I do

sympathize though with what a personal trial 9 / 11 was to her and her husband. As well as many of those serving

at that time at Bethel as well as those living in the region. As I noted, it is just one of many of the reasons that went

into the collective decision for the Governing Body to decide to make the move. Something else we saw as we took

our tour of NYC was the rate of crime there. Our tour guide warned of all the pickpockets and stolen goods being sold

openly in Battery Park. And as we no sooner got into the NYC area  you could feel a complete change in the attitude

of the people. They were completely rude ( from a Midwest standpoint anyway ) and if you didn't have money you

just didn't exist. How unconducive these conditions serves for all who on a daily basis rubs shoulders with these

conditions and attitudes. These are just a few of the things I saw in 2005 that caused me to wonder if the time had

come for the Brothers to consider moving to a better place. I'm glad they saw this as Jehovah's leading. But like anything

else in our lives, our Brooklyn Headquarters  carry precious memories, there being the feeling of sadness and nostalgia.

 

GStorrs46

 

GStorrs46

[pnutts]

I knew a brother that served at Bethel. He saw the 2nd plane hit.

His wife was in Furman St building ( now a condo ) and had to be evacuated due to the dust.

 

Never went to Brooklyn Bethel due to bad rep area had in 70's. Plus I hate Big Cities!

 

Very glad at the move. Finally!!!

[Rosalie4u]

I went to visit Brooklyn HQ on three separate occasions - and I have to say that I am one of those who did not like that it was in a big city and all the problems of getting around in the city (traffic, using subway, tunnels) and all the many warnings by the brothers we were told to remember every time - it about made you paranoid to be there! 

 

It is directly because the brothers worked so hard to improve these buildings and the area that this DUMBO area of Brooklyn is worth so much more now!  Frankly, I am so relieved they are getting out of the big city (all I did was worry during 9 / 11 about the brothers and sisters and ever since then too!) and it will be so much more relaxing to be able to visit the new HQ, if I choose to do so again.

 

One of the brothers was planning a new trip for the friends last year and all I could do was think "I want to wait until they are relocated to that beautiful acreage with the lake!"

[Hope]

Just personally, I'll miss them being in Brooklyn. I LOVE New York - it's so exciting to me. And I loved having such a haven as Bethel nearby.

I understand the need to move Upstate and it will be wonderful. But NYC turns me right on... I'll have to think of other excuses to visit.

[destiny]

I lived in NYC for 15 years, but was not in the truth at that time...missed opportunities......they were not on my radar..

[timpin]

I know I wish I could afford to buy whatever sort of residence they create from these properties.  I love that neighborhood and the view across to Manhattan... seriously, a dream location!  

 

 

I understand why it's no longer dreamy for HQ. But it would be great for me - I love NY.. and Brooklyn Heights is just my style of neighborhood.

 

 

It's sentiment ruling here....

 

 

Just personally, I'll miss them being in Brooklyn. I LOVE New York - it's so exciting to me. And I loved having such a haven as Bethel nearby.

I understand the need to move Upstate and it will be wonderful. But NYC turns me right on... I'll have to think of other excuses to visit.

 

seriously sis comments lately are a concern as to what side of the fence (river in this case) draws you   ...   [no matter what our personal feelings are, personal adjustments are quickly needed to abide with all the new major directional changes the FDS are making] ...  and there are many more yet to come!

Edited January 1, 2016 by timpin

[Qapla]

seriously sis comments lately are a concern as to what side of the fence (river in this case) draws you   ...   [no matter what our personal feelings are, personal adjustments are quickly needed to abide with all the new major directional changes the FDS are making] ...  and there are many more yet to come!

 

This makes no sense to me.

 

Liking NY, or any other city, is no different than liking it out west where all that flooding is occurring or the mountains where snow and sever weather can bring avalanches.

 

I could say that I would have liked to see the HQ moved to Florida - would that make you question me?

 

Just because someone likes a particular type of location is no reason to question their "side of the fence" - after all, there is NO scriptural basis to assume that there will not be cities in the New System and that anyone who likes living in a city is wrong.

[Hope]

seriously sis comments lately are a concern as to what side of the fence (river in this case) draws you   ...   [no matter what our personal feelings are, personal adjustments are quickly needed to abide with all the new major directional changes the FDS are making] ...  and there are many more yet to come!

Ermmm.... I don't know what you're talking about, brother. It's wonderful the HQ is moving upstate and I can't wait to visit the new facilities. It IS sentiment that some may feel sad or even offended that our once centers of pure worship may be used now for worldly or false religious purposes.. but that's how it goes.

I've always loved big cities, particularly NYC. I don't believe there's anything wrong wishing I could afford to live there or that I like visiting.

I guess I'm not seeing your point.

[Shawnster]

Ermmm.... I don't know what you're talking about, brother. It's wonderful the HQ is moving upstate and I can't wait to visit the new facilities. It IS sentiment that some may feel sad or even offended that our once centers of pure worship may be used now for worldly or false religious purposes.. but that's how it goes.

I've always loved big cities, particularly NYC. I don't believe there's anything wrong wishing I could afford to live there or that I like visiting.

I guess I'm not seeing your point.

You aren’t the only one.

[leoperales]

seriously sis comments lately are a concern as to what side of the fence (river in this case) draws you   ...   [no matter what our personal feelings are, personal adjustments are quickly needed to abide with all the new major directional changes the FDS are making] ...  and there are many more yet to come!