Paris attacks caused archbishop to 'doubt' presence of God

[Dave]

You'd think he'd keep his doubts to himself...

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-34893039

[Jodievt]

Makes me think of that scripture where those of the clergy would deny their association when BTG falls. Wierd that he represents his church and openly does that

[niall]

They only ever worshiped a made-up God anyway. Certainly not the God of the Bible.

And this just goes to show how much he knows about what's in the Bible:

So governments have to be the means of justice," he said.

Archbishop Welby also said the manner in which IS militants had distorted their faith, so that they believe their acts are glorifying their God, is "one of the most desperate aspects of our world today".

And then he goes on to demonstrate his ignorance of Christendom's history of using exactly the same belief system to justify their involvement in worldly wars.
Edited November 22, 2015 by niall

[Desert Dan]

The archbishop said: "Saturday morning, I was out and as I was walking I was praying and saying: 'God, why - why is this happening? Where are you in all this?' and then engaging and talking to God. Yes, I doubt."

 

No problem Justin Welby - you can ask any of our young ones in our congregrations the answers to your questions above.   I am sure they would be willing to point you to the answers in your own copy of the bible. 

 

I would hope the Church of England did not post his comment on their website.   The 26 million baptized members may be unclear of the answers to his questions as well.

[Tortuga]

This raises an interesting personal question. How would you feel if a terrorist attack or bomb killed one of the GB or a Helper?

[Áine]

This raises an interesting personal question. How would you feel if a terrorist attack or bomb killed one of the GB or a Helper?

Seeing as we don't view members of the GB or their helpers as Gods then it shouldn't effect us at all!

Sent from my GT-P5210 using Tapatalk

[Tortuga]

Seeing as we don't view members of the GB or their helpers as Gods then it shouldn't effect us at all!

Sent from my GT-P5210 using Tapatalk

True, in that sense. I should start another topic because I think it would be interesting to see how we would feel about it and what other people would do or say about it.

[rbrown1205]

All of the Apostles that we know of were either killed in persecution or died in exile.  They along with the older men in Jerusalem formed the example that the Governing Body uses for its own activity. Yet, Jehovah took and takes care of his own.  This life is not all there is.

 

I honestly accept that God will not give us more than we can take, and even if the relief is in death, we will be resurrected.

 

Our lesson today showed that faithful ones like Stephen was killed in persecution, but Jehovah can and does safeguard us overall.

Edited November 22, 2015 by rbrown1205

[Áine]

True, in that sense. I should start another topic because I think it would be interesting to see how we would feel about it and what other people would do or say about it.

I find it very strange that you would find it interesting. ..it's a black and white subject not a grey area

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

Edited November 22, 2015 by anniebea

[Tortuga]

All of the Apostles that we know of were either killed in persecution or died in exile.

Exactly, so should we expect Satan to use terrorist activity to kill some of the GB or Helpers? I think that might shake the faith of some in the organization even if we expect it. I think non-believing family members would use that to create doubts.

I personally think we need to be mentally and emotionally prepared.

[rocket]

Does not Rev. 20:4 say that some of the Anointed will be brutally murdered before become Kings with Christ in heaven. I would celebrate the fact that they run the race to the end. They All must die before Armageddon, the how doesn't matter. When my grandfather died, the family was sad that we would never see him again but happy that he was with his Lord and Savior in a new assignment he waited his whole life for.

[shali]

Jehovah is going to have to do away with the GB's fleshly bodies before Armageddon anyways so if someone else took their life it would only increase our faith, another King has taken his rightful place in heaven - the sooner the better I say.

[Shawnster]

Does not Rev. 20:4 say that some of the Anointed will be brutally murdered before become Kings with Christ in heaven. I would celebrate the fact that they run the race to the end. They All must die before Armageddon, the how doesn't matter. When my grandfather died, the family was sad that we would never see him again but happy that he was with his Lord and Savior in a new assignment he waited his whole life for.

 

I think some who are immature in the faith or who lack faith would be shaken at the murder of one of the GB.  It would be as in the days of Jesus.  

 

(Matthew 26:31) 31 Then Jesus said to them: “All of you will be stumbled in connection with me on this night, for it is written: ‘I will strike the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock will be scattered about. . .

 

I'm not saying the Anointed are equal to Christ.  I do think, however, some Witnesses do put these brothers up on an extra high pedestal.  Just look at how some view the Anointed in general.  They probably hold the Governing Body in higher esteem and regard.  If Satan were to strike at one of these brothers, it would crush all of us.  Those who are immature in the Faith would scatter.  It would cause some to seriously doubt whether this is the Truth or not.  That's just how people are.  Sad to say.

[shali]

I wouldn't be crushed, probably shocked, but definitely not crushed. Jesus foretold this is how Satan's seed would treat his brothers.

[carlos]

I understand sometimes something happens that shakes the faith of some. It shouldn't happen, but it does. But I fail to see why the violent death of one GB member should be one of those events.

 

People die everyday due to violent acts, including some of our brothers. The GB members are not different in the least from anybody else. Jehovah never promised to give them or any of us any special protection. In fact, the Scriptures foretell that many of the anointed will be killed violently.

 

So if one of them is killed by a terrorist attack, I would feel sorry to miss him, but it wouldn't affect my faith or my activity in the least. Many GB members have died along the years and that didn't really change anything in the organization. I guess I would be much more affected if the one killed in those attacks were a member of my family or a close friend.

Edited November 22, 2015 by carlos

[Tortuga]

I understand sometimes something happens that shakes the faith of some. It shouldn't happen, but it does. But I fail to see why the violent death of one GB member should be one of those events.

 

People die everyday due to violent acts, including some of our brothers. The GB members are not different in the least from anybody else. Jehovah never promised to give them or any of us any special protection. In fact, the Scriptures foretell that many of the anointed will be killed violently.

 

So if one of them is killed by a terrorist attack, I would feel sorry to miss him, but it wouldn't affect my faith or my activity in the least. Many GB members have died along the years and that didn't really change anything in the organization. I guess I would be much more affected if the one killed in those attacks were a member of my family or a close friend.

 

Exactly, that was my point but I think it's a good idea to be prepared for that reality so our faith isn't shaken.

 

I think it will be interesting to see how others would react to one of the GB being killed by a terrorist attack, I would think they would say that is proof that Jehovah doesn't protect his people, we know the answer to that but it's still a good idea to accept the reality of it and be prepared.

[carlos]

I think it will be interesting to see how others would react to one of the GB being killed by a terrorist attack, I would think they would say that is proof that Jehovah doesn't protect his people, we know the answer to that but it's still a good idea to accept the reality of it and be prepared.

 

No GB member has been killed violently to date, probably because they perform most of their activity in a country where very few people are killed in terrorist attacks anyway.

 

But it's true that Jehovah doesn't protect his people against terrorist attacks. Some decades ago a bomb in a KH killed and injured many brothers in Australia. Some years ago some brothers were beheaded by Muslim terrorists in Philippines. And I know of several friends who were injured in the train bombs in Madrid in 2004.

 

Jehovah protects his people from a spiritual viewpoint. Besides, following his advice gives us a measure of protection. But as long as we live in Satan's world Jehovah cannot guard us against crazy violence, the same as he cannot guard us against sickness, natural disaster or old age. Anyone who expects that from Jehovah will be disappointed.

[Tortuga]

No GB member has been killed violently to date, probably because they perform most of their activity in a country where very few people are killed in terrorist attacks anyway.

I was thinking about how often the GB or Helpers fly to other countries and I was thinking about the reaction if their plane was blown up by terrorist.

[carlos]

I was thinking about how often the GB or Helpers fly to other countries and I was thinking about the reaction if their plane was blown up by terrorist.

 

Yes, I understand your point. It could happen. But actually very few planes (compared to the millions that fly everyday) are blown up by terrorists and relatively few people are killed in terrorist attacks (except in the specific areas where terrorist groups rule).

 

For example, the Paris attacks are considered one of the worst terrorist attacks ever. However, every year in France double of that amount of people die in car accidents. Or every month in Spain. So the possibilities that a particular person in a Western country is killed in a terrorist attack are very very reduced.

 

On the other hand, I don't think Satan has a particular interest in killing GB members. If they die, they go directly to heaven. As long as they are alive as imperfect humans, they can still be corrupted. Satan has sometimes killed Jehovah's servants to pressure them to compromise, but killing someone in a plane bombing does not help him at all.

 

But of course unexpected events can strike at any time.

[niall]

Satan would get more of a reaction if he made one of the GB out to BE a terrorist. That's the tactic he's using in Russia, though it's against our organisation rather than an individual GB member.

How many week ones stumble when an elder is disfellowshipped? Imagine how many more if it were one of the GB - especially now they are all more familiar to us due to the Monthly Broadcast. They would be a juicy prize.

We just need to remember that we don't worship Elders, or the GB. So, however sad it might be if Satan made one of them fall, we worship Jehovah alone.

[carlos]

On March 11, 2004 in Madrid 191 people were killed and almost 2000 injured when Islamist terrorist put bombs in several trains full of commuters at peak hour.

 

A mass funeral service was held in the Catholic Cathedral and thousands attended, including most European political leaders. The archbishop who held the service, quoted "My God, why have you forsaken me?" and was unable to give any answer. He didn't say a word about the kingdom or the resurrection hope. Not a very comforting nor spiritually upbuilding homily, I'm afraid.

 

False religion doesn't have satisfying answers to the questions that really matter.

[GrumpysWife]

God needed more Angels….