No Room for two Judicial systems? -Finland

[JahisKing]

http://yle.fi/uutiset/justice_minister_ ... nd/7219841

Why the focus on us???  Isn't the Catholic's "judicial" system similiar? I thought that they excommunicate too...

[trottigy]

Interesting find:

Based on first-hand accounts of 18 former church members, the UUT report claims that an internal judicial committee handed down harsh sentences including ostracism to offending church members

[Astrid]

another artice on the same website: http://yle.fi/uutiset/ngo_calls_on_ministry_to_probe_closed_religious_groups_jehovahs_witnesses_under_scrutiny/7219755

[Mykyl]

So full of inaccuracies its a joke. "threats of violence", "undergo a humiliating repentance exercise which involves attending services twice weekly for a month without being greeted by congregation members.", "Jehovah’s Witnesses are suspicious of higher education so elders are not well-educated.". lol.

 

If it was not so serious it is hilarious.

 

Utter nonsense and easily seen for what it is.

Edited May 6, 2014 by Mykyl

[JahisKing]

Interesting find:

Based on first-hand accounts of 18 former church members, the UUT report claims that an internal judicial committee handed down harsh sentences including ostracism to offending church members

Are we burning people to stakes? Lol I wonder what prompted this probe.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

[trottigy]

Apparently those 18 got together and said, "lets frame trouble by decry". No need to wonder why they were DFd, eh?

[Adelin]

http://yle.fi/uutiset/justice_minister_ ... nd/7219841

Why the focus on us???  Isn't the Catholic's "judicial" system similiar? I thought that they excommunicate too...

I never understood this thing .... it's like I would meet someone on the street and greet him, but he would not; then I would greet him again, but he doesn't ... so I go to him and say : << You really don't wanna talk to me ?!!!     I'm gonna bring you to trial !!! >>  

[Astrid]

that's just so stupid, every tiny little club has its own regulations and statutes that you have to follow if you want to be a member of this club. And nobody would ever accuse them of having their own jurisdiction. 

 

Funny thing is that Finland is always example number one in European news and magazines, because they seem to have the best school system in Europe. This is really sad.

[Shawnster]

This is an example of why we no longer say someone is disfellowshipped.  Instead, they are no longer one of Jehovah's Witnesses.  

 

Jehovah's Witnesses do this this and this.  They do not do that that or that.  If someone does things Jehovah's Witnesses don't do, or doesn't do things we do, then they aren't Jehovah's Witnesses.  That's plain and simple.  

 

We even have allowances for "oops, I  messed up.  I didn't mean to do that..."  When someone is removed from the Organization, it's because their words or actions indicate they do not want to live by these standards.

 

We don't collect dues.  We don't bill members.  This isn't some organization where "I paid my dues, I'm a member..."  Likewise, we don't have quotas for commenting or contacting individuals.  You can't force a conductor to call on a specific person.  It's the conductor's choice if he chooses to call on someone that raises their hand.  Likewise, you can't force me or anyone else to associate with certain people.  We can even be in the same room with someone and ignore them.  If we choose to ignore someone (whose disfellowshipped), or choose to not call on someone at the  meeting (whose disfellowshipped), then what harm is done?  How is that subverting Finland's judicial process.  Is it because we're calling this a "judicial" committee?  Will we see a name change for this procedure?  Will Finland force people to talk to each other instead of ignore them?  Will there be Finnish monitors at the meetings to make sure we call on everyone that raises their hand?  

 

What a joke.

[Adelin]

so bad i do not live in Finland ... i could have brought to trial the moderators of this site for not giving me full access membership and more ... i would have asked 1 million dollars for moral damage - wow i'd be rich 

         )))

 

(hope you have the sense of humor,     

 

 but recognize it's the best example of the state being)

[rocket]

so bad i do not live in Finland ... i could have brought to trial the moderators of this site for not giving me full access membership and more ... i would have asked 1 million dollars for moral damage - wow i'd be rich 

         )))

 

(hope you have the sense of humor,     

 

 but recognize it's the best example of the state being)

Only you can cure that. You might want to give some prayerful thought to the topics you try to post.

[Adelin]

it was just a joke brother ... but a good example of what happens there in Finland

[JABA]

The Nordic countries are a bit special regarding civil rights.

The Finland was one of the first countries to ban physical punishment againts children under any circumstances, even a slap, both at home and in public places such as schools.

They have a phone line where children can call to acuse their parents of physical punishment. And some of them use this fact to blackmail their parents.

Nevertheless, I don't believe the Finland's Justice Minister did understood the matter in question and just replied to a report without knowing the facts.

[Bluebell]

Jehovah's Witnesses to hand over top-secret manual

On Friday Finland's Jehovah's Witnesses will give their religious rule book to the Minister of Justice and the Minister of the Interior so that it can be inspected to ensure that it's in line with Finnish rule of law.

Until now, only senior members of the Jehovah’s Witnesses Committee have had access to the congregation's secret book of rules.

The disciplinary activities of the Jehovah's Witnesses Committee have been criticised for violating human rights.

According to Anna-Maja Henriksson, Finland's Minister of Justice, the purpose of the handover is to examine the book and determine whether its rules and regulations run counter to Finnish law.

Henriksson and Interior Minister Päivi Räsänen met on Thursday with the leadership of the Jehovah's Witnesses in Helsinki. The book will be handed over on Friday for inspection.

According to representatives of the Jehovah's Witnesses, committee practices have been changed recently and the committee no longer addresses or interferes in the matters of its members that are considered to go against church guidelines. 

http://yle.fi/uutiset/jehovahs_witnesses_to_hand_over_top_secret_manual/7244267

.......how ridiculous...

[Adelin]

According to representatives of the Jehovah's Witnesses, committee practices have been changed recently and the committee no longer addresses or interferes in the matters of its members that are considered to go against church guidelines. 

what does this mean ?

[trottigy]

It means - Until you hear from JW.org about it, they can say whatever they want as they have a free press.

[Adelin]

i know it but that statement ... what is the fact behind that ?  or is a fact behind it ?

[Mykyl]

My first thought would rather be, Was that what was actually said.

[trottigy]

We have not received a new elders publications that says no more judicial committees. The branch has NOT sent out instructions telling the elders they no longer need to keep the congregation clean.

[Bluebell]

Satan's propaganda   .......he loves to put confusion amongst us.....and some bite...

don't fall for it....

[Dustparticle]

Satan's propaganda   .......he loves to put confusion amongst us.....and some bite...

don't fall for it....

I agree 100 percent sis. It is Satan and his dupes are doing this.

[rbrown1205]

Now I guess we have to wait and see what they do with our brothers' book.  Will they broadcast it all over the press?  I don't want to know what it contains, but Jehovah's enemies would like to malign and misrepresent it.

[trottigy]

Its already available on many apostate sites.

[Stavro]

So far, we only have the words of one side, as reported by a single media outlet, and the story so far has not been picked up by any non-apostate source.

 

Rather than speculate on what "facts" might be behind this report, I'm mentally filing this away as another apostate hoax until there's an official comment on the matter, from the branch or from the government. And given the tendency of the media to focus on anything and everything JW-related, no matter how vague the connection, I think their extended silence on the issue shows just how factual the story really is.

 

(w04 9/1 pp. 16-17 pars. 14-15 Beware of “the Voice of Strangers”)
Although some news reports about Jehovah’s Witnesses are fair, at times the media let themselves be used to broadcast the biased voice of strangers. For instance, in one country a news report falsely stated that the Witnesses supported Hitler’s regime during World War II. In another one, a report accused Witnesses of vandalizing churches. In several countries the media accused Witnesses of refusing to give medical treatment to their children and also of deliberately condoning serious sins committed by fellow believers. (Matthew 10:22) Even so, sincere people who know us personally recognize that such accusations are false.

What should we do if we are confronted with accusations spread by the voice of such strangers? We do well to take to heart the counsel of Proverbs 14:15: “Anyone inexperienced puts faith in every word, but the shrewd one considers his steps.” It is unwise to believe everything presented as truth in the media. While we certainly do not distrust all secular information, we do recognize that “the whole world is lying in the power of the wicked one.”—1 John 5:19.

[Adelin]

We have not received a new elders publications that says no more judicial committees. The branch has NOT sent out instructions telling the elders they no longer need to keep the congregation clean.

i just thought it could be some new detail that i'm not aware of 

of course, the arrangement of disfellowshiping could never be stoped because it is a bible principle, not an only jw principle