JW Parents take their sick boy from hospital

[Cool Cat]

Thank you for the clarification. It just shows how we should not believe every word. Especialy not from the media

Hartley

Not even 10 months ago we had this :-

 

Can You Trust the News Media?

[Toy Poodles]

I wonder how long this family has been dealing with drs. I wish I knew more, did their son suddenly become sick and they rushed him to the hospital and found out he had brain tumor, the drs did surgery and then wanted to shoot the boy with radiation even though they didn't feel it would be positive. If that is how it happened what a wirl wind this family has gone through in a matter of days. 

But even if they have been dealing with a sick child for months or years, the parents go on auto pilot and just get done what needs to be done and nothing else. Both ways these parents have suffered enough. 

If I had listened to the drs at UC Davis with 2 of my 4 children, I would have buried them already. As a parent you don't take anyones opinion as gospel, not doctors not anyone, you research and look at all sides of the matter and find who will back you up and support you. 

[sunshine]

A friend recently bought this topic to my attention and I've just read through this thread. I would like to thank helen post #124 for her excellent summary.

It seems that Jehovah has used this tragic situation to bring glory to his name and clarify for the public our position on medical treatment. I fear red tape and the British Hospital official's need to save face may work to the childs detriment far from the public eye, when focus has moved on and dearly hope a technicality will not mean he doesn't get quick treatment.

It is not clear at this precise moment in time who has legal charge of the child, ie regardless of the fact that the family is reunited, who makes the final decision of where and what treatment he receives. But i suspect it's not the parents. Knowing the British heathcare system/child protection services I fear there will be a quieter and less publicized "round two" and that the King family will pay dearly for their actions (REALLY hope I'm wrong).

Whatever the outcome I think this is a lesson for us all on speaking before we have all the facts about a matter and taking a balanced view of the media.

May Jehovah help the King family, I'll pray for them tonight.

Edited September 8, 2014 by sunshine

[rocket]

Ashya King arrives in Prague for cancer treatment
 
http://www.itv.com/news/story/2014-09-08/ashya-king-arrives-in-prague-for-cancer-treatment/

[futurepromise]

I guess my opinion differs from everyone on this thread.

I'm trying not to pass judgment either way but

after reading various news stories after this broke IMO they seem to be willing to ANYTHING to save their son.

You are passing judgment as soon as you added "but". Please remember you are talking about a Brother and this thread is open to the public.

“Who are you to judge the house servant of another?” (Rom. 14:4) In his letter to the Romans, Paul discussed problems that arose in the first-century congregation. Some Christians, coming as they did from a variety of cultural backgrounds, were inclined to pass judgment on the decisions and actions of their fellow believers. Paul’s question reminded them to welcome one another and to leave judging in Jehovah’s hands.

Likewise today, Jehovah’s people come from all walks of life. Yet, Jehovah has brought us together in precious unity. Do we contribute to that unity? If we are inclined to express quick disapproval of a brother’s conscientious course of action, how wise it would be to ask ourselves Paul’s question above!

not judging brother: w10 4/15 15; w09 5/15 23; w08 3/15 26-27; w07 6/15 20; w05 6/1 13; w02 11/15 18; cl 161-164; w01 11/15 22-23; w97 11/15 20-21; w96 3/15 22-23; w95 10/15 30-31; w90 10/1 22-23; w86 6/1 24-25

http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1200273196

[sunshine]

Thank you brother Tilford for the update. Good news indeed. I'll continue to pray for our little ones health!!

Jehovah never forgets us in our trials - Song #110 (one of my favorites) comes to mind.

[car49]

I was quite surprised to read a few negative comments on jwtalk when this story first made the headlines especially as even non-members can read comments and discussions on JWTALK.

Ashya has been constantly on the news in the UK, almost every few hours on SKY & BBC news there have been updates on his latest condition and whereabouts - The majority are wishing Ashya and his family well and after the original reference to the family being witnesses, it is rarely mentioned except by the obvious few that are prejudicial against JWs.
Here are a few encouraging comments about the family in UK newspapers and mags ... you can read the full articles on their websites:    
⦁  The Spectator - Rod Liddle 6 September 2014 ......The King family have been in the news because of young Ashya King, aged five, who is suffering from brain cancer. Ashya was being treated at University Hospital, Southampton, before his mum and dad — Brett and Naghemeh King — took him away to find better treatment somewhere else. There is no suggestion whatsoever that the family’s religious beliefs were involved in this perfectly legitimate decision, although I will wager a small bet that the terrible existence of those beliefs were lodged somewhere in the minds of the health professionals in Southampton who promptly overstepped their remit and called in the police..........Following fairly high levels of outrage among the public and the press at this arrogant and callous treatment, the family has now been told it will not be extradited. But why were they arrested in the first place? The Department of Health’s own guidelines for the medical care of children is quite clear in this regard, and explained in its booklet ‘Consent — What You Have A Right To Expect: A Guide for Parents’. It states at the outset: ‘Parents are expected to make health care decisions for their children, based on what they feel is in a child’s “welfare” or “best interests”.’ My italics. That is precisely, to the very letter, what Ashya’s mother and father did.  The booklet adds that the quacks can overrule the parents only after first having obtained a court order to that effect.... Upon being asked under what auspices the Kings might be subjected to extradition from Spain, the Hampshire police muttered something about ‘neglect’, but refused to expand, adding only that the Kings might well not be charged with such an offence anyway. Now there has been a volte face and the Crown Prosecution Service has announced that the family will face no charges.

⦁  3 September 2014 Melissa Kite for the Daily Mail: How could public servants be so pitiless that they let little Ashya suffer while they ticked their boxes? Watching Mr and Mrs King being treated like criminals for taking their son abroad in a desperate attempt to cure him of an aggressive brain tumour almost made me ashamed to be British.Our healthcare system, police and prosecutors were all utterly ruthless in their pursuit of the couple, who so obviously wanted nothing other than to look after their five-year-old, whose life hung in the balance.....And when the state was forced to back down because of the clamour of national outrage, not one of these institutions, nor any of their senior staff, was prepared to accept any blame. None of them has apologised to the King family for making them suffer such a harrowing ordeal.Hanging over this dreadful episode has been the sad sight of that little boy lying alone in a hospital bed in Spain while his parents were in police custody accused of neglecting him.The ultimate irony, Kafkaesque in its cruelty, seemed to be lost on those intent on the Kings’ extradition: while the child’s parents were fighting charges of neglect, Ashya was, indeed, suffering from neglect - because his mother and father were prevented from being with him.

⦁ Josh Halliday and Owen Bowcott - The Guardian, Monday 8 September 2014 -  Ashya was flown by private medical jet to Prague on Monday from the Materno Infantil hospital in Málaga where he had been treated for more than a week. He is due to be admitted to Prague's Proton Therapy Centre on Tuesday morning for tests before potentially undergoing specialist treatment next week.His case made headlines after his parents took him from Southampton General hospital without the consent of doctors on 28 August. The couple, from Southsea in Portsmouth, travelled to Spain where they were arrested and held in custody. They were released when British prosecutors withdrew an arrest warrant in the wake of a public outcry.The high court judge Mr Justice Baker appeared to question the decision to obtain a European Arrest Warrant, saying in a ruling on Monday: "I merely observe that as a consequence Ashya was left alone for several days."The judge added: "Having heard the evidence, I conclude that there was no reason to stand in the way of the parents' proposal."................He said: "Responsibility about a child rests with his parents. In most cases the parents are the best people to make decisions about a child. The state has no business in interfering in the parental responsibility unless the child is suffering or is likely to suffer considerable harm."...........Both treatment options were reasonable, he said. "It is no business of this court or any other public authority to interfere in [the parents'] decision.".........The judge concluded: "It only remains for me to express my hope that Ashya makes a good recovery. We send all our best wishes to Ashya and his loving parents."
 

From our last Sundays WT Study - July 15th WT - P10 Par 15 ..... Should we, however, be suspicious of our fellow Christians, second-guessing the genuineness of their loyalty to Jehovah? Absolutely not! It would be wrong to entertain baseless suspicions about our brothers and sisters. (Read Romans 14:10-12; 1 Corinthians 13:7.)  

 

Most of the brothers whom seem know to the family give encouraging reports and a young brother (aged 16) shown on the news - took thousands of petitions (mostly from witnesses I think) - to the Prime Minister - demanding their release.
The most distressing news when the parents were released was to hear Bro King stating "he could hear Naghemeh crying 2 cells away and there was nothing he could do to comfort her"  Sister King on being released said: "....all I could do was Cry & Pray .... for the first time she could not be with Ashya - as she had been 24/7 for many weeks

 

Great News - how this has turned out for the family.  Is. 41:10 " I will fortify you. I will really help you. I will really keep fast hold of you with my right hand of righteousness. "  encouraging words already mentioned.                                                                       

They now are where they wanted to be - receiving the treatment they think is best for their son - paid for by donations received (not only from brothers) but also any balance of costs to be donated by a childrens charity. All this would not have happened I feel - if they were not being looked after by Jehovah - they are certainly being fortified.
Whatever the outcome for young Ashya - all our prayers on his behalf and the family - surely will support them in the weeks ahead.

 

The Latest 8 September 2014: Ashya King has arrived at Prague's Proton Therapy Centre this morning for tests before treatment his parents have 'every confidence' will cure his brain cancer.The five-year-old's father Brett admitted that his unwell son 'will be scared' but his mother Naghmeh will be there to hold his hand. Ashya was flown by private jet from Spain to Prague, where he is expected to start pioneering treatment for his brain tumour in the next week after being monitored by experts today.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2747284/Little-Ashya-way-Czech-cancer-specialists-pioneering-treatment-save-life.html#ixzz3CoJvBgv3
 

[car49]

Ref: It is not clear at this precise moment in time who has legal charge of the child, ie regardless of the fact that the family is reunited, who makes the final decision of where and what treatment he receives. But i suspect it's not the parents. Knowing the British heathcare system/child protection services I fear there will be a quieter and less publicized "round two" and that the King family will pay dearly for their actions (REALLY hope I'm wrong).

 

 

Rosie - The High Court in London have returned custody to the parents - The ruling was to be in force as soon as they arrived at The Proton Therapy Centre in Prague

 

From Todays News ....theguardian.com, Monday 8 September 2014 16.51 BST    Owen Bowcott, legal affairs correspondent

Ashya King no longer a ward of court - High court in London frees boy from legal controls, saying it is now up to parents to decide on treatment he should receive

 

Ashya King, the five-year-old boy flown to Prague to be treated for a brain tumour, has been freed from all legal controls by the high court in London.

Formally ending wardship proceedings, the judge, Mr Justice Baker, said it was now up to Ashya's parents to decide which of the treatments on offer he should receive – conventional radio therapy from a hospital in Southampton or the proton therapy available in the Czech Republic.

The judge's decision was announced following confirmation that the Motol hospital in Prague had admitted Ashya for treatment.

Baker said: "Responsibility about a child rests with his parents. In most cases the parents are the best people to make decisions about a child.

"The state has no business in interfering in the parental responsibility unless the child is suffering or is likely to suffer considerable harm."...............

 

Let's hope this ruling sets a precedent for any future authorities trying to get Court orders!!  -  Should be a great help to Witness parents.

  
   
 

[car49]

A friend recently bought this topic to my attention and I've just read through this thread. I would like to thank helen post #124 for her excellent summary.

It seems that Jehovah has used this tragic situation to bring glory to his name and clarify for the public our position on medical treatment. I fear red tape and the British Hospital official's need to save face may work to the childs detriment far from the public eye, when focus has moved on and dearly hope a technicality will not mean he doesn't get quick treatment.

It is not clear at this precise moment in time who has legal charge of the child, ie regardless of the fact that the family is reunited, who makes the final decision of where and what treatment he receives. But i suspect it's not the parents. Knowing the British heathcare system/child protection services I fear there will be a quieter and less publicized "round two" and that the King family will pay dearly for their actions (REALLY hope I'm wrong).

Whatever the outcome I think this is a lesson for us all on speaking before we have all the facts about a matter and taking a balanced view of the media.

May Jehovah help the King family, I'll pray for them tonight.

 

Latest news is quite encouraging

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/sep/08/ashya-king-no-longer-ward-high-court-parents-treatment

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/sep/09/ashya-king-cancer-treatment-70-per-cent-chance-survival

[JahisKing]

You are passing judgment as soon as you added "but". Please remember you are talking about a Brother and this thread is open to the public.

“Who are you to judge the house servant of another?” (Rom. 14:4) In his letter to the Romans, Paul discussed problems that arose in the first-century congregation. Some Christians, coming as they did from a variety of cultural backgrounds, were inclined to pass judgment on the decisions and actions of their fellow believers. Paul’s question reminded them to welcome one another and to leave judging in Jehovah’s hands.

Likewise today, Jehovah’s people come from all walks of life. Yet, Jehovah has brought us together in precious unity. Do we contribute to that unity? If we are inclined to express quick disapproval of a brother’s conscientious course of action, how wise it would be to ask ourselves Paul’s question above!

not judging brother: w10 4/15 15; w09 5/15 23; w08 3/15 26-27; w07 6/15 20; w05 6/1 13; w02 11/15 18; cl 161-164; w01 11/15 22-23; w97 11/15 20-21; w96 3/15 22-23; w95 10/15 30-31; w90 10/1 22-23; w86 6/1 24-25

http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1200273196

Judgment goes both ways.(positive or negative) Judgment is not always negative or damning as you believe I have implied. I think the earlier comments in this thread before the "facts" started trickling in is a testament to that. You are free to discard my "judgement " or opinion as not worth 2 cents as the cyber paper its written on.

My opinion probably differs from yours. We can just leave it at that.

[ReadYourBible]

2 Tim 2:14.

[futurepromise]

Judgment goes both ways.(positive or negative) Judgment is not always negative or damning as you believe I have implied.

My opinion probably differs from yours. We can just leave it at that.

This is the meaning of judgement:

the faculty of being able to make critical distinctions and achieve a balanced viewpoint; discernment

the forming of an opinion, estimate, notion, or conclusion, as from circumstances presented to the mind:

I hope you will reason on Jehovah's word and reflect how He views one who forms a judgement on another brother. As the above definition says, 'the ability to make', we don't have the complete story nor can we read a person's heart, we don't have the ability! Therefore we let judgement up to Jehovah.

[Hartley]

I,m not sure as to all the details of this matter. I have seen however that this brother is willing to go to extraordinary lengths to protect his son and to protect his relationship with Jehovah. Even the judges and officials admit they have intervened to the detriment of this family. I tend to think that Jehovah will find no trouble finding faithful ones in this family.

[futurepromise]

Our Brother and his family are all faithful, loyal servants of Jehovah. Now is the time for us to be loyal to our brother. Be warned that Satan will try a subtle attack to cause disunity to our united brotherhood. Any acts of wrongdoing does not go unnoticed by Jehovah and Jesus, the head of the congregation. Our Brother is an Elder in his congregation, please give him the respect and love he has the right to expect from us.

Be patient and wait on Jehovah. I don't want to read in this thread any negative links to press releases that put the family in a bad light or bring reproach on Jehovah's name. Remember that is manipulation by Satan to cause in us a lack of peace

[JahisKing]

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ashya-kings-father-says-hell-4256798

If the press is NOW slandering this brother.... Then I'm pretty sure we should expect another YouTube video soon. The press has now quoted the son AND the father saying that blood transfusions are acceptable.

If they are miquoting or out right lying on this family... I smell a lawsuit .

I'm pretty neutral and I won't be villified because I share a different opinion. Starvo's initial instinct /comment in this thread IMO was spot on. The "facts" are still coming in. Should you trust the Media? Not all the time. Are they all liars? No. Many are credible. Unless you believe that only reports that you may personally view as "negative" or "unfavorable" are not credible. We all can use our God given abilities to reason and sort through the rubbish. If what the media is reporting is true... I expect them to sensationalize this story to a whole new level.

Nonetheless, I share the sentiments of all here who believe that whatever the case is... Much prayer is needed to strengthen the family , congregation and all here who are obviously affected by this story.

[On the huh]

Judgement! I started this topic, my words "Bad news.  Why have they done this?  Hopefully will come to their senses and bring him back for medical treatment."  Judgemental or what!  I feel bad about it, but I can't delete my comments.  Lesson to be learned there.  But many of you brothers and sisters have been very positive and saying many good and encouraging things about the family and the situation they had found themselves in.

 

Watching the family on a news report, the father was wearing a suit.  Someone said, he looks like an elder, I wonder if he is.  I don't know how they could tell that he is an elder by the suit he wore, but funny now, reading the comments confirming that he is.

[PottersClay]

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ashya-kings-father-says-hell-4256798

Mirror reports that Mr. king would allow a blood transfusion.

I'm not so sure he really said this, mirror is reputable (from what I know of it anyway) but its the only one reporting this and Mr. King's comment could be misquoted or even just taken out of context.

[pgwenlan]

According to Brothers who had lunch at Twickenham convention with the parents Co-ordinator, the Father, Bro King, is a respected Elder in his congregation...

[rocket]

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ashya-kings-father-says-hell-4256798

Mirror reports that Mr. king would allow a blood transfusion.

I'm not so sure he really said this, mirror is reputable (from what I know of it anyway) but its the only one reporting this and Mr. King's comment could be misquoted or even just taken out of context.

 

From what I understand the "Mirror" is by their own definition a tabloid or gossip sheet. At any rate they do not Quote Bro. King as making the statement that he would allow a blood transfusion. It is their surmise. I would think only apostates would make something of such articles. Is it not better to allow all the facts to come out before jumping on any band wagon?

 

 

Mirror Online: The intelligent tabloid. #madeuthink 

 

Daily Mirror

All the latest news, sport and celebrity gossip at Mirror.co.uk. Get all the big headlines, pictures, analysis, opinion and video on the stories that matter to you.

 

[Sallyforth]

Actually, The Mirror is a tabloid, and not considered a reliable source.

 

Besides, no where in the article does Brother King specifically say he would allow a blood transfusion. I would say it is an assumption. As a parent, I know that we do all we can to avoid our children receiving blood transfusions, but I believe in the case of minor children (who are not old enough to understand and explain their beliefs), the legal system does have the final say and can (and usually will), get a court order to enforce a transfusion.

 

I could be wrong, but that's the way I understand it now. BTW, if I am wrong about that, please feel free to say so!

Edited September 14, 2014 by Sallyforth

[Mykyl]

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ashya-kings-father-says-hell-4256798

Mirror reports that Mr. king would allow a blood transfusion.

I'm not so sure he really said this, mirror is reputable (from what I know of it anyway) but its the only one reporting this and Mr. King's comment could be misquoted or even just taken out of context.

How about we don't continue to gossip against those who are apparently our brothers. Especially gossip started by the news media.

 

Unless you have facts direct from their mouth and you hear it with your own ears... well then talk to the elders and stop spreading malicious gossip.

 

I can only imagine what it would be like to get wind that my brothers were gossiping untruths about me as they would rather believe the media of this system and spread their ideas.

 

The media WILL dig up whatever to keep the story going. That's a fact.

Edited September 14, 2014 by Mykyl

[futurepromise]

I suggest that this topic be closed. This is unacceptable behavior to continue this debate. It is gossip, and harmful to our unity. Be willing to step aside and recognize that it is Jehovah who sets matters straight.

Do not post anything that you would feel uncomfortable to speak in front of our brother. You all know the actions that would be taken if this thread was instead discussed in 'real life' within the congregation.

[Hartley]

I suggest that this topic be closed. This is unacceptable behavior to continue this debate. It is gossip, and harmful to our unity. Be willing to step aside and recognize that it is Jehovah who sets matters straight.

Do not post anything that you would feel uncomfortable to speak in front of our brother. You all know the actions that would be taken if this thread was instead discussed in 'real life' within the congregation.

 

I suggest that this topic be closed. This is unacceptable behavior to continue this debate. It is gossip, and harmful to our unity. Be willing to step aside and recognize that it is Jehovah who sets matters straight.

Do not post anything that you would feel uncomfortable to speak in front of our brother. You all know the actions that would be taken if this thread was instead discussed in 'real life' within the congregation.

Much of this topic has been in suport of our brother and has spoken of the lack of reliable information in the papers etc. When unreliable information hes been quoted it has been in the context of being pained due to the reproach it gives. I do not see anything on this thread where a brother or sister reproches the king family.

[Mykyl]

Much of this topic has been in suport of our brother and has spoken of the lack of reliable information in the papers etc. When unreliable information hes been quoted it has been in the context of being pained due to the reproach it gives. I do not see anything on this thread where a brother or sister reproches the king family.

Repeating it is gossip. We know where we are meant to stand regarding gossip. Gossip can very quickly become slander and that is very serious. Do not repeat negative unsubstantiated rumour based on media reports would be my advice. We again were reminded of this at our convention. Pretty clear I would have thought.

Gossip

casual or unconstrained conversation or reports about other people, typically involving details which are not confirmed as true.

[futurepromise]

Repeating it is gossip. We know where we are meant to stand regarding gossip. Gossip can very quickly become slander and that is very serious. Do not repeat negative unsubstantiated rumour based on media reports would be my advice. We again were reminded of this at our convention. Pretty clear I would have thought.

Gossip

casual or unconstrained conversation or reports about other people, typically involving details which are not confirmed as true.

That being said, we should cease repeating what news articles say about the King family. If you continue to post this secondhand information YOU are spreading gossip and Jehovah is seeing what you are doing. Unless someone from their family keeps us updated, please STOP posting your opinion,(a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge).