JW.org - Rashad Niftaliyev Fined and Jailed for Participation in Religious Meetings

[JWTalk]

<img src="http://assets.jw.org/assets/m/ijw15lg/802015704/ijw15lg_id-802015704.art/802015704_univ_sqs_sm.jpg"width="75" height="75" style="float: left; padding: 0 10px 10px 0;" />

<p style="display: block; float: left; min-width: 150px;">This is the second time in 14 months that he has been punished, even though Azerbaijan has no law against meeting for worship.</p>

View the full article on JW.org

[waccamacca]

Why can't all the fines be paid by some special fund where we donate from around the world to help brothers who are fined and jailed? 

[richietj77]

Why can't all the fines be paid by some special fund where we donate from around the world to help brothers who are fined and jailed?

Some governments doesn't allow to receive money from outside the country for the payments of these fines.

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[crazylee]

Paying a fine can be considered an admission of guilt. We aren't guilty of anything.

 

Jehovah can and will take care of this atrocity as he has for others.

 

Keep praying for God's will to be done and keep preaching.

[On the huh]

If the governments realised the organisation is paying the fines they keep on arresting even more of our brothers and charging more fines.  No, this has to go through the legal system to stop the arrests and stop and clear the fines.

[waccamacca]

I understand your comments however if you ever live in the ex USSR and have actually listened to the stories of brothers and sisters who have been arrested and spent up to 19 years in prison for their ' theocratic crimes' then you will be much more sympathetic to their plight and desire to be free. I have held the hand of a 82 year old sister whose tears wet her face while my wife translated her story. If I wasn't already sending money every month to family and friends to survive their economic struggles I would be glad to pay this brothers fines and see him released from prison. We know brothers in Azerbaijan, Ukraine, Russia and Belarus and have regular contact so aware more than most of their daily struggles. I just have a different perspective from most westerners. But I do understand your point of view. dasvadanya Tim

[stuagu]

i wouldn't want to comment on this case specifically as I wouldn't want to make any brothers situation worse... But if in a similar situation we paid a fine wouldn't they just arrest again for another false charge and get another release payment? Prayer is what is neede on our brothers behalf I think.

[jwhess]

As a perspective:  In the USA and Canada during the 1930s and 1940s the brothers faced the prison time instead of paying money (even when given a choice).   This included brothers, sisters, old and young.  I knew a young pioneer sister who was pregnant and pushed down a flight of stairs before being jailed.  If paying fines to stay out of prison was Jehovah's way now, we would be notified of the opportunity to share.  God's hand is not short nor is His organization without the necessary funds or concern.  All of us in the worldwide brotherhood care deeply.

[waccamacca]

I lived 31/2 years in Ukraine and have friends in mainly Russia and Ukraine but also have wife's relatives in Belarus. I have seen the brothers there pray but then act on a number of initiatives that we find unusual in the west. If you read the 2002 yearbook there are some recounting their prison experiences that we know personally, especially a sister in our last congregation called Maria Tomaliko. Elders told us that Maria was the most persecuted sister in Ukraine. I mentioned her in a post when she told us her story at 82 years old. In fact a brother on the Ukraine branch committee told me that they had to 'water down' the yearbook experiences because New York told them that " the brothers in the West wouldn't be able to handle it".  I remember a young brother in Brisbane being told off by 2 elders in the library because he brought his tablet to the KH and was told never to bring it back again. Our last CO only used his tablet when giving his talks. Many times the changes by the GB started at the grass roots level long before it was made official. Unless someone actually has lived in the ex USSR then it's hard to understand the difficulties of life when suffering persecution. My wife is going to Ukraine and Russia next month for 7 weeks and I look forward to getting her viewpoint on how the situation has changed since she was there last year. I will update when she returns. 

[Doug]

  In the '80's I lived in So. California. One small municipality, Camarillo, applied to us the laws regulating solicitors, peddlers etc.  They attempted to charge us for a permit to go door-to-door preaching. It amounted to a fee for their permission to exercise our faith.  Doing so without the permit could result in a fine.

 

We refused to pay the fee, but were willing to pick up the permit and carry it on us. A permit was required for each occasion we were in the ministry, they were not good for a week or month.  So, we flooded the office of the clerk every morning after the meeting for service to collect our permits.

 

I'm sure this local government heard from the legal department because they abandoned their interpretation of the laws as they apply to us.  Point of this; we don't pay for permission to serve God nor do we pay sanctions for doing so.

[Tortuga]

  In the '80's I lived in So. California. One small municipality, Camarillo, applied to us the laws regulating solicitors, peddlers etc.  

 

Off-topic: I use to do flooring and helped install a lot of carpet in Camarillo in the late 70's. I liked the area.

[Doug]

Do we know each other?  I'm a flooring contractor.

[Qapla]

I spent 20 years installing flooring but I don't think I know either one of you - in person

[Julsey]

Off-topic: I use to do flooring and helped install a lot of carpet in Camarillo in the late 70's. I liked the area.

Wow. I have a good friend who used to live there.  I wonder if you know her!

[campanula]

 My wife is going to Ukraine and Russia next month for 7 weeks and I look forward to getting her viewpoint on how the situation has changed since she was there last year. I will update when she returns. 

Thanks, Brother. That would be enlightening reading for us...

 

P.S. Why don't let to your wife participate here so others can get first hand information?

[campanula]

What a small world!  LOL  Just six handshakes away

Off-topic: I use to do flooring and helped install a lot of carpet in Camarillo in the late 70's. I liked the area.

 

Do we know each other?  I'm a flooring contractor.

 

I spent 20 years installing flooring but I don't think I know either one of you - in person

 

Wow. I have a good friend who used to live there.  I wonder if you know her!

[waccamacca]

Priviet sister Sveta,

 

lol My wife will never participate on an english forum. Believe me when I say it's not her cup of tea.  But thanks for the offer. I shall summarize her experiences on her return. But it's nice to see you here. I have been across the Black sea from Odessa to Istanbul by boat. Where are you from? Poka Tim

[campanula]

Priviet sister Sveta,

 

 I have been across the Black sea from Odessa to Istanbul by boat. Where are you from? Poka Tim

Hi, Tim. Nice to see you here too.

I'm from Sevastopol, Crimea, (Russia ->Ukraine->USSR->Russia->Turkey->Greece-> Whoknowsland)  

 

It was indicated in my profile before, but I decided to replace it after certain comments.  

Too sensitive topic to discuss for some members.

 

 Sorry for offtopic  

[waccamacca]

I have been to Crimea 3 times on holiday with my wife. I like Sevastopol and of course Yalta. My wife Iryna is from Dnepropetrovsk. None of her family are jw's. Take care sister Sveta. Christian lyubov Tim