Calling Jehovah 'Daddy'

[Vinnie]

When my children were at the single digit ages they called me daddy, then later in the double digits it was  dad then later still....well.... they stopped calling me. (lol)

 

(1 Corinthians 13:11) . . .When I was a babe, I used to speak as a babe, to think as a babe, to reason as a babe; but now that I have become a man, I have done away with the [traits] of a babe.

(Matthew 6:9) . . .Our Father in the heavens, let your name be sanctified.

 

 

 

[GrumpysWife]

Up until my father passed away, I called him Daddy. But he was a human and not my Heavenly Father. 

I have heard some who no longer serve Jehovah call him "Papa" & "Daddy" showing no respect for His position. IMHO

[nanceebgd46]

8 minutes ago, GrumpysWife said:

Up until my father passed away, I called him Daddy. But he was a human and not my Heavenly Father. 

I have heard some who no longer serve Jehovah call him "Papa" & "Daddy" showing no respect for His position. IMHO

 

I agree with you Vernalee....it's strictly a backhanded compliment...(insult) actually,

and that is exactly what their intentions were!

[dove]

Doesn't the term Papa come from the Italian word for pope? El Papa in Spanish?

Wouldn't want to make that connection...

[Thesauron]

Doesn't the term Papa come from the Italian word for pope? El Papa in Spanish?
Wouldn't want to make that connection...

It's not derived from there, but have a common etymology. Papa is a false cognate, but might be traced back to baby babble, and employed mostly thanks to parents building a "baby-talk lexicon", if you will. The expression comes from Greek via Latin and Middle French.


Johan

[carlos]

3 hours ago, Dove said:

Doesn't the term Papa come from the Italian word for pope? El Papa in Spanish?

Wouldn't want to make that connection...

 

No, Sandra. It's the other way around. "Papá" means "dad" in Spanish and Italian and several other languages. Since he's the "holy father" for the Catholics, they ended up calling him "Papa". 

[Qapla]

And here I always thought it was the "Poop of Rome" 

[minister159]

So, by extension,would it also be objectionable to refer to Jehovah's heavenly wife-like organization of faithful angelic creatures as "mama," instead of "mother"?

 

"But the Jerusalem above is free, and she is our mother." --- Gal. 4:26

 

[dove]

1 hour ago, carlos said:

 

No, Sandra. It's the other way around. "Papá" means "dad" in Spanish and Italian and several other languages. Since he's the "holy father" for the Catholics, they ended up calling him "Papa". 

Thank you for correcting that Carlos. I don't speak either language so got it backwards..

[GrumpysWife]

18 minutes ago, minister159 said:

So, by extension,would it also be objectionable to refer to Jehovah's heavenly wife-like organization of faithful angelic creatures as "mama," instead of "mother"?

 

"But the Jerusalem above is free, and she is our mother." --- Gal. 4:26

 

It is to me, but I have heard many use that to refer to it this way. 

[Patinage]

I would never address Jehovah by calling him Daddy, it sounds inappropriate to me as well.

But, in some languages, the word Father is translated as Dadi or Papa or Tata, because I guess they don’t have another word… except that one. In that case, the word doesn’t convey a lack of respect, on the contrary, it conveys an idea of deep affection towards our heavenly Father. When reading the text in Haitian creole, for example, in my mind, I’ve got the image of a young child turning to his father for protection, confident he will do him no harm.

Please consider this part of Matthew 6:9 in the following languages (just a few examples taken from our jw.org website) : “Our Father in the heavens”

Haitian creole (Haiti) : « Papa nou ki nan syèl la »

Papiamento (Curaçao) : « Nos Tata ku ta den shelu »

Seychelles Creole : “Nou Papa ki dan lesyel”

Solomon Islands Pidgin : “Dadi bilong mifala long heven”

Tok Pisin (Papua New Guinea) : “Papa bilong mipela long heven”

As you may have noticed, all these languages are creoles or pidgins which are, according to Wikipedia, “a mixture of simplified languages or a simplified primary language with other languages’ elements included”. Creoles and pidgins are mainly derived from European languages, including (by alphabetical order) Dutch, English, French, Portuguese and Spanish, and roughly speaking they originate from European colonialism and settlements outside Europe.

By the way, you may understand why when knowing one creole language along with the main language, it is easy to understand (at least, in my case, if I read it loud) other creole languages, except for a few variants. They are all linked together.

Only when speaking in Creole I would feel at ease using the term “Papa” when referring to Jehovah. But if I turn to the main language, I would use “Father”.

[nanceebgd46]

 

I likewise don't feel comfortable calling Jehovah.....daddy.

Because the word ....in a sense, deflates Jehovah's

magnificence, grandeur and power...I prefer...Almighty God Jehovah.

 

Anyhoo, have you ever heard the saying..."What does a 'kept' woman 

                                                                        call her male benefactor?"

 

Her Sugar Daddy!

I rest my case!

 

 

                                                                         

 

 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2017 by nanceebgd46
edit

[CHecker]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels as I do. I've also heard him referred to as Papa too. Either one, in English language, are just not acceptable. I think about it from the stand point of saying a prayer. Jesus, as the example, called him Father. Never do we hear him referring to Jehovah in a casual, simplified terminology.

I've been thinking about this for a while. I think next time I hear her say 'Daddy' I'll speak with her about it. She should know better.

 

[dove]

It makes it seem like they are bringing Jehovah down to a human level..

[Patinage]

I agree 100%. In English or in French for that matter, it does sound right nor appropriate nor acceptable.

 

I was trying to enlarge the discussion by saying that when switching to other languages, in that case, creole or pidgin languages, we cannot sustain the same logic since the word for Father is Papa or Dadi (Daddy) in those languages, and we cannot qualify that term in those languages as shocking... In other words, a speaker may use the word Papa in creole but when switching, let's say, to English, he will use the word Father and never Daddy. And that speaker will be respectful in both languages, and hearers in both languages will understand the idea without being offended, say in Creole when using the word Papa.

 

That is the reason why translating a text is such a hard task : conveying the right idea and choosing the proper and accurate words to project the original author's thoughts.

[Ferb]

From 1st April 2009 Watchtower:

Quote

Why did Jesus in prayer address Jehovah as “Abba, Father”?... The International Standard Bible Encyclopedia states: “In the colloquial speech of Jesus’ time, ʼabbāʼ was primarily used as a term of informal intimacy and respect by children of their fathers.” It was an endearing form of address and among the first words that a child learned. ...
“ʼAbbāʼ as a form of address to God is extremely uncommon in Jewish literature of the Greco-Roman period, doubtless because it would have appeared irreverent to address God with this familiar term,” continues the above-mentioned reference work. However, “Jesus’ . . . use of this term in prayer is an indirect attestation of His extraordinary claim to intimacy with God.” The other two Scriptural occurrences of “Abba”—both in the writings of the apostle Paul—indicate that first-century Christians also used it in their prayers.

 

Several questions from this:

1. If you think that a word for father (out of the several words the greeks had, such as 'pater', used in Luke 2:48) that is 'among the first words that a child learned' doesn't translate as 'Daddy' or 'Dad', can you explain the logic underlying that conclusion?

2. Isn't the argument that such a word shouldn't be used for God because it's irreverent, according to that article, the same argument used by the false religious teachers - and apparently rejected by first-century Christians, even while on Earth?

3. Isn't that the exact same argument people used - and still use today - against praying to God using his name?

 

I don't say 'Dad' in prayers either, but it's purely a matter of the consciences of others - an application of 1 Corinthians 8:13.  If it were only myself I had to consider, that's definitely what I'd say.  But to those who talk about how wrong it sounds to say 'Dad', I make the following proposition: the only reason that sounds wrong to you is that you're not used to hearing it.  If everybody said that in their prayers for a year, it would sound perfectly normal to you, it wouldn't occur to you to think there was anything remotely disrespectful about it just as there's nothing disrespectful about 'father'.  And some religions will find the word 'father' disrespectful too, by the way - because whichever word you use, you're implying a close relationship with God, which to some people will be blasphemous.  But as long as we are claiming that, why not claim it in plain English that everybody uses?  Because nobody uses the word 'father' to address their Dad anymore.  Fun fact - when the King James Bible was written, words like 'thee' and 'thou' weren't common even then.  The reason that old Bible used uncommon language is that it was felt it made it more reverential to use such language.  The same arguments made here for using 'father' in your prayers are the ones made to justify using 'thee' and 'thou' in the Bible.  I'm glad we have more natural language in our Bible, and I'd be glad if we had more natural language in our public prayers.  If you had the word 'Dad' used in prayers for a while, I suggest that addressing God as 'father' in prayers would start to seem as silly to you as making a Bible that's full of ye olde English.  Which, as you might have noticed, to me it already does.  Asking a young person to say a public prayer and address God as 'father' is like asking them to pray in a language they don't speak.  Maybe it's different if you grew up in the fifties or something, but the notion of calling someone 'father' doesn't exist in the English language we younger people speak today, anymore than the word 'thou' exists in it.  We're aware of it, but it's essentially part of an old, dead language that we don't speak anymore, and isn't the language of our heart.  We say that in a prayer because it's expected, but we aren't speaking from the heart when we do, just uttering an artificial phrase like 'our father, who art in heaven, hallowed by thy name'.  If we could call Jehovah 'Dad', then we'd be speaking from the heart, and our prayers would both be easier to say, and I think, be more meaningful to Jehovah.

[Stavro]

2 hours ago, Ferb said:

1. If you think that a word for father (out of the several words the greeks had, such as 'pater', used in Luke 2:48) that is 'among the first words that a child learned' doesn't translate as 'Daddy' or 'Dad', can you explain the logic underlying that conclusion?

 

When a child calls their father "daddy", it's endearing. When an adult calls their father "daddy", it is off-putting and disrespectful. When an adult who calls someone who is not their father "daddy", it's creepy.

 

Abba was a term of respect, daddy is not. Translation is not a 1-1 science where every word has an exact equivalent in every language, so the translators have to do their best. When even their best does not convey the proper meaning, the word will be transliterated and the meaning explained in depth elsewhere. See also: Sheol, hades, messiah.

[Hope]

1 hour ago, Stavro said:

 

When a child calls their father "daddy", it's endearing. When an adult calls their father "daddy", it is off-putting and disrespectful. When an adult who calls someone who is not their father "daddy", it's creepy.

 

Abba was a term of respect, daddy is not. Translation is not a 1-1 science where every word has an exact equivalent in every language, so the translators have to do their best. When even their best does not convey the proper meaning, the word will be transliterated and the meaning explained in depth elsewhere. See also: Sheol, hades, messiah.

 

Just popping in to say I continue to call my father Daddy and I'm 52 years old.  People who don't like it can have a nice day!

 

However, it is extremely inappropriate for anyone to be that casual with Jehovah.

[GrumpysWife]

Quote

When a child calls their father "daddy", it's endearing. When an adult calls their father "daddy", it is off-putting and disrespectful. When an adult who calls someone who is not their father "daddy", it's creepy.

I am 76 yrs old. I called my father Daddy all of my life up until the day he died. Even now when talking to people who knew my father, I still refer to him as Daddy. My children who are all in their 50's call my husband Daddy. I don't find it off putting or disrespectful. 

[dove]

29 minutes ago, GrumpysWife said:

I am 76 yrs old. I called my father Daddy all of my life up until the day he died. Even now when talking to people who knew my father, I still refer to him as Daddy. My children who are all in their 50's call my husband Daddy. I don't find it off putting or disrespectful. 

 

My Sil who is now in her late 60's also called her father Daddy until he died..and her mother, Mommy..

Edited September 11, 2017 by Dove

[dove]

1 hour ago, Stavro said:

 

When a child calls their father "daddy", it's endearing. When an adult calls their father "daddy", it is off-putting and disrespectful. When an adult who calls someone who is not their father "daddy", it's creepy.

 

Abba was a term of respect, daddy is not. Translation is not a 1-1 science where every word has an exact equivalent in every language, so the translators have to do their best. When even their best does not convey the proper meaning, the word will be transliterated and the meaning explained in depth elsewhere. See also: Sheol, hades, messiah.

 

I was 'liking' it for the reference of Abba being a term of respect. Certainly if Jesus used the word in his personal prayer to his Father, it was not disrespectful or offputting in any way.

[Stavro]

I did not intend to start a debate on the merits of calling one's father "daddy" in a private context, my main point was that "daddy" is universally regarded a an informal nickname, and in modern English it carries a less respectful tone than "father". The sentiment behind "abba" is not an informal nickname, it carries even more respect than "father'.

 

When we use the title of father to refer to Jehovah, we are generally referring to his role as creator, and we are his indirect children through Adam. But when an anointed one uses abba, the sentiment is closer to "my true father", in reference to the adoption. Jehovah is not simply the creator of their ancestors, he is an immediate family member, even closer than one's own fleshly father, and the term reflects that deep respect.

[GrumpysWife]

I totally agree with you about calling Jehovah "Daddy". My exact comment above was "In my opinion it is presumptuous and disrespectful".  However I felt that saying calling your own personal father "daddy" as an adult was disrespectful, was going a bit far. No debate or discussuon necessary. I just needed to point out that some of us do actually use that term. Sorry for any problem my comment might have caused. 

[carlos]

20 hours ago, Ferb said:

Maybe it's different if you grew up in the fifties or something, but the notion of calling someone 'father' doesn't exist in the English language we younger people speak today, anymore than the word 'thou' exists in it.  We're aware of it, but it's essentially part of an old, dead language that we don't speak anymore, and isn't the language of our heart. 

 

David, while I think your comment is interesting and appreciate the alternative viewpoint, I think it is a bit exaggerated to say that "father" is no longer used in English and that it's comparable to the word "thou". By looking at movies, newspapers, books or simply conversations people have, I would say the word "father" in English is alive and well. Probably "father" is not the most popular word among toddlers and small children, but it's quite the standard term among adults to refer to your male parent.

 

[harmania]

I've sometimes heard use of word ''heavenly father'' in prayer.

 

Do you view jehovah as your father? 

https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2010125?q=do+you+view+jehovah+as+your+father&p=par

Edited September 12, 2017 by harmania