Russia invades Ukraine

[hatcheckgirl]

3 hours ago, Jonadab said:

but most certainly neither side of the war is right, and in this crossfire are our dear brothers, let the urgent Kingdom come !

Thanks you for this comment. I can see our brothers and sister’ comments here have tried their best to stay neutral. But the fact is (and this is an indisputable fact) that Russia was the aggressor and Ukraine was invaded.

 

What happens in war is always brutal, but we are seeing the lowest of the low in human ferocity. It is actually traumatic to us to read about how those poor people and the atrocities they are suffering. And it comes out in our comments. These are innocent and helpless people being attacked in their homes by soldiers from a barbaric state (we fear even more now for our Russian brothers since this is how that regime deals with their enemies).

 

So, with quite a bit of restraint shown for the overwhelming emotion I know we are all feeling when we read about Bucha or Irpin or Mariupol, places we never knew of before, I would argue that there has not been a non-neutral comment here. Rather, we are in horror and very saddened by the events by the aggressor. And no, no one here is advocating for the Ukrainians to pursue their attackers and also commit non-Geneva Convention atrocities back. They will do that anyway as they are driven by extreme hurt, unimaginable loss and fury. Satan will always exploit that anger.

 

Instead, we rightly point to what our Great Comforter has said will solve all problems. Let’s please not act judgemental and unnecessarily start another division here on comments. Rather, acknowledge and move on. And keep this a peaceful place, especially as this war is so raw. Our emotions can be fragile.

 

“Further, reject foolish and ignorant debates, knowing that they produce fights. For a slave of the Lord does not need to fight, but needs to be gentle toward all, qualified to teach, showing restraint when wronged” -

2 Tim 2:24.

[Sofia]

10 hours ago, Sheep said:

Excuse me. I'm a brother

  I ve done it again ! 

 

Mobile doesnt show name/sex and I should have known you for months now. Please forgive me.... again 😕

10 hours ago, Sheep said:

It's there that Russia continues to veto virtually everything

yes... annoying no-end trail. Only time and Jehovah will show how that will end up. 😉 

[Sofia]

10 hours ago, Saffron said:

I truly hope that Putin does not drag this out for another month.

He said he wishes to end the war on may 9th ( annniversary of germany capitulation to Soviet Union back in 1945) But he keeps lying all the time ....

4 hours ago, cme said:

Thats why the GB says to watch the news once a day.  We can unwittingly become angry at this senseless war and unknowingly start to take sides or have opinions.   The spirit of this world is pervasive.  Our Government is the Kingdom! 

Thank you CArmen

[Old]

7 hours ago, zoebarry said:

Haven’t you all seen the videos of Ukrainian soldiers deliberately shooting Russian POWs in the knees, foot or groin? 
 

There are atrocious acts being committed on BOTH SIDES of this war. Neither side is innocent, so this is why WE NEED TO NE NEUTRAL. 
 

I see many comments from the members here that are CLEARLY NOT NEUTRAL..... 

https://observers.france24.com/en/europe/20220331-ukraine-russia-video-prisoners-of-war 

The other side of the story:

 

"There's no blood in the video and the men don't moan or scream after being shot. But according to experts interviewed by the BBC, this can happen: lack of blood is sometimes a feature of a gunshot wound, especially on someone with a tourniquet, and the men may not have cried out due to shock."

[Saffron]

1 minute ago, Sofia said:

He said he wishes to end the war on may 9th ( annniversary of germany capitulation to Soviet Union back in 1945) But he keeps lying all the time ....

It's only April 4th, so that is more than one month longer for these poor people to suffer. 😭

You are right though. He lies to a point of pure gaslighting, so there is no telling what will happen. How would anyone know on which date they will win or lose a war? Does this even make sense? 

 

Thank you dear sister @hatcheckgirlfor putting into words what I can not. The way that people are behaving like animals these days, it's just very upsetting. 

 

[Lee49]

13 minutes ago, Saffron said:

He lies to a point of pure gaslighting,

Ain't that the truth! 

 

[Sofia]

Another shot on the foot ... I wonder how long BTG will last more...

Moscow patriarch repeats propaganda regarding war

https://www2.stetson.edu/religious-news/220403a.html

"At the same time, we must be faithful—I have military personnel primarily in mind—to our oath and readiness "to lay down our life for our friends," the patriarch concluded. ( Putin has quoted Jo.15:13 at least twice in public too) 

[Hugh O'D]

On the Ukrainian side

Quote

Provided by @Old

https://observers.france24.com/en/europe/20220331-ukraine-russia-video-prisoners-of-war

 

Oleksiy Arestovych, an adviser to Volodymyr Zelensky, announced in an interview posted on Telegram that the Ukrainian government would investigate the events shown in this video. In a post on his Instagram account, he added: "I would like to remind our soldiers, civilians and defence forces that mistreating prisoners of war is a war crime."

On the Russian side

Quote

Quote

Please do not read this link, I'm only including it for the sake of all things being checkable

https://uk.yahoo.com/news/torture-room-discovered-putin-killing-212230619.html

 

And although Russia has denied the allegations that it has been behind the string of disturbing killings, suggesting that they happened after Russia began to withdraw from the region, satellite imagery shared with The Daily Beast and first reported by The New York Times reveals Russia is lying through its teeth. Many of the dead bodies in question were on the streets of Bucha approximately 20 days before Russia withdrew.

How's that for balance 😊

 

Yes, both sides are Satan's side.

 

Yes there are "good" and bad on both sides (I've read one Ukrainian account where it was Russian officers who disarmed and took away one of their own who was a rapist saying he would be shot).

 

At the moment one side is committing most of the atrocities. It's not violating neutrality to say that. We're violating neutrality when we start hoping one side or the other has a victory and no one has said that here.

 

But if the war spills over either into Russia or it's vassals then the balance of who's committing atrocities will start going the other way. Which is another reason we're all staying neutral here.

[Hugh O'D]

13 hours ago, GeordieGirl said:

I feel somewhat bemused by this as I cannot imagine deliberately giving poisoned food or drink to anyone, not even my worst enemy,

Well you wouldn't do that because you obey Jesus commands as to how to treat your enemies as we all want to.

 

But Ukraine's message keeps being how everyone is involved in one way or another with the fight whether it's throwing Molotov cocktails at trucks or letting others know when they see the trucks so others can ambush them instead. In that environment everyone looks for what they can do, in other lands they might strap on suicide belts. They could even point to Jael using a tent peg to justify it in their minds.

 

I suppose we can take from it that we want to look for every way we can to save lives in the ministry.

 

Ps

14 hours ago, GeordieGirl said:

This 'appears' to be true as it seems to be on every newspaper in the Western world,

For what it's worth I appreciate your efforts to post what you can verify. I see many items that I just file away because I can't double check them, it's appreciated to know others are also careful what they post.

[BLEmom]

43 minutes ago, Hugh O'D said:

Well you wouldn't do that because you obey Jesus commands as to how to treat your enemies as we all want to.

 

But Ukraine's message keeps being how everyone is involved in one way or another with the fight whether it's throwing Molotov cocktails at trucks or letting others know when they see the trucks so others can ambush them instead. In that environment everyone looks for what they can do, in other lands they might strap on suicide belts. They could even point to Jael using a tent peg to justify it in their minds.

 

I suppose we can take from it that we want to look for every way we can to save lives in the ministry.

 

Ps

For what it's worth I appreciate your efforts to post what you can verify. I see many items that I just file away because I can't double check them, it's appreciated to know others are also careful what they post.

I watched a Canadian public news bit about Bucha.

The most emotional thing was watching a little boy in the hospital cry for his papa.  That so broke my heart. 
 

The other thing was watching a single mother whose only son was killed. What struck me about her story, was how hate perpetuates in these situations. She was wanting the Russians to die and wished their children dead. 
 

The demons work hard to foment hate. These are the situations where relatives, neighbors and friends become enemies. 
 

It’s one thing reading about it in history books. It’s another watching it happen before our eyes. 

[Lee49]

9 minutes ago, BLEmom said:

The most emotional thing was watching a little boy in the hospital cry for his papa.  That so broke my heart. 
 

Yes, it touched me also! 

[Dhanyel]

Ukraine President Zelenskiy says he will address UN Security Council on Tuesday 👀

https://www.reuters.com/world/ukraine-president-zelenskiy-says-he-will-address-un-security-council-tuesday-2022-04-04/

[Michelle112]

6 minutes ago, Jonadab said:

Ukraine President Zelenskiy says he will address UN Security Council on Tuesday 👀

https://www.reuters.com/world/ukraine-president-zelenskiy-says-he-will-address-un-security-council-tuesday-2022-04-04/

Oooooh, watch this space 😉

[Dhanyel]

18 minutes ago, Michelle112 said:

Oooooh, cuidado com este espaço 😉

Thank you, I need to learn how to reduce this font, it comes exactly in the size of the original article 

[GeordieGirl]

10 hours ago, zoebarry said:

Haven’t you all seen the videos of Ukrainian soldiers deliberately shooting Russian POWs in the knees, foot or groin? 
 

There are atrocious acts being committed on BOTH SIDES of this war. Neither side is innocent, so this is why WE NEED TO NE NEUTRAL. 
 

I see many comments from the members here that are CLEARLY NOT NEUTRAL..... 

No I haven't seen videos like that and neither would I want to or need to.  Why would any Christian even consider deliberately looking at videos that portray indiscrimate violence and horror. Isn't what is portrayed in the media enough?

 

If this was a reference to me, I didn't say anything that could be construed as taking sides. And yelling at people to get your point across is not particularly pleasant. There are other, kinder, more polite ways to counsel people, if that is your intention.  Otherwise, your comment is just judgemental.

 

9 hours ago, Saffron said:

 

 

I'm sure details of who killed and maimed who could be pieced together through other sources, but the one that I was responding to was an article about Ukranians poisoning Russians. It's located a couple of comments above mine.  

 

My point was that I can't say for sure what I would have done (as a non-witness in the world) if I was sitting there minding my business when a bunch of armed men who have been raping and killing people burst into my neighborhood with an intent to do the same to my family. You'd be surprised what adrenaline can make you do when your mind has not been made over by teachings from the Bible.

 

If I was in the world, I could not imagine my response if I, or my children and family were personally being attacked. And in that worldly scenario, if people were being held at gunpoint and ordered to make food for the soldiers, I get that someone might make the decision poison their food. It would be an act of self preservation and a defence.

 

However, it would appear that this was not the case in this instance.  The food was given 'as gifts'.  I don't know about you, but if someone was coming at me to attack me, the last thing I would think to do is say 'would you like a yummy sandwich'.

 

If you re-read my post, the point was about having the ability to look someone in the eyes and offer them refreshments in a manner of friendship, knowing it would poison them - because the report said they were given as gifts.

 

I am not in the world, and empathising with worldly peoples' responses to violence or putting myself in their shoes to understand the whys and wherefores of their behaviours is not something I either want, or try, to do. 

Our personal responses should be to  find all acts of violence despicable, regardless of what form they take or which side they come from, not to make excuses for the way they act.  I found this particular act to be horrible because of the way it was actioned. It had nothing to do with which side did it.

 

I haven't read anywhere that people have been raped, though.  Maybe you could share a link to verify that.

 

Edited April 5, 2022 by GeordieGirl

[GeordieGirl]

5 minutes ago, Jonadab said:

Thank you, I need to learn how to reduce this font, it comes exactly in the size of the original article 

When you copy and paste the original article into this box, it gives you an option at the bottom to 'Paste as plain text instead'. If you click on that it will reduce the heading to the normal size.

[Saffron]

8 minutes ago, GeordieGirl said:

haven't read anywhere that people have been raped, though.  Maybe you could share a link to verify that.

I don't have it in me to go searching for articles about them raping and torturing people right now. Maybe later.  It can easily be found via Google search in the meantime though. 

 

Once again, I'm not making excuses for worldly people's behavior. I'm not sure in what language I need to explain that I find ALL of this revolting. I only said that I was not surprised while reading that some people chose to retaliate in this way. They also throw molotov cocktails and shoot at them too. 

 

I recently saw a video of a woman beating a bus with a bat and when a man tried to stop her from leaving, she attempted to run him over 3 times. Horrid, but again not surprising given the state of people in the world today. 

 

My apologies to everyone for lamenting on the fact that people are so depraved nowadays that very little is shocking anymore. Since I'm giving off vibes of not being neutral and making excuses for the behavior of worldly people, I will leave you all in peace to enjoy this thread. 

[Doug]

29 minutes ago, GeordieGirl said:

 

If I was in the world, I could not imagine my response if I, or my children and family were personally being attacked. 

 

I am not in the world, and empathising with worldly peoples' responses to violence or putting myself in their shoes to understand the whys and wherefores of their behaviours is not something I either want, or try, to do. 

Our personal responses should be to  find all acts of violence despicable, regardless of what form they take or which side they come from, not to make excuses for the way they act.  I found this particular act to be horrible because of the way it was actioned. 

Honestly,  I question how I would respond if someone I care for was being attacked.  And I mean that as a Christian.  We can snap too. It can be very difficult to think clearly under circumstances that you find extremely wrong.  Hopefully, I would at least pray before doing something equally wrong.

 

As for the poisoned snacks, that was pre-meditated. Not a knee-jerk response in the heat of the moment.

 

I think of our brothers in the concentration camps who were trusted so much because they were genuine Christians.  Our brothers were given the responsibility of shaving the Nazi officers.  I can't imagine a Russian officer trusting a Ukrainian POW to shave his throat with a straight razor.

[GeordieGirl]

35 minutes ago, Doug said:

Honestly,  I question how I would respond if someone I care for was being attacked.  And I mean that as a Christian.  We can snap too. It can be very difficult to think clearly under circumstances that you find extremely wrong.  Hopefully, I would at least pray before doing something equally wrong.

We absolutely can which is why the slave keeps telling us to strengthen our relationship with Jehovah now. And to strengthen our faith now. 

When the time comes that we could be in the position our brothers are currently in, hopefully our knee-jerk response will be to pray.  Not  retaliate.

35 minutes ago, Doug said:

As for the poisoned snacks, that was pre-meditated. Not a knee-jerk response in the heat of the moment.

That was my point in my original post about this and in the one you commented on. It was the cold-blooded way in which it was planned and executed and not as a response to an attack.

Edited April 5, 2022 by GeordieGirl

[Shawnster]

17 hours ago, zoebarry said:

 

 

I see many comments from the members here that are CLEARLY NOT NEUTRAL..... 

Which comments on here are you reading that show support for one side or the other in the Ukraine war? 

 

Neutrality does not mean people must read about, comment on, and express public horror at the atrocities committed by both sides of this conflict. By that logic, this article on jw.org is not neutral because it only discusses Ukrainians who had to abandon everything and flee https://www.jw.org/en/news/jw/region/global/Ukrainian-Refugees-Share-Stories-of-Leaving-Everything-Behind/

 

 

[hatcheckgirl]

I can't at all get my head around the very serious misinformation the Russian government is spreading on the Bucha massacre (as in fact the whole war so far).  To the extent of saying the corpses found by the Ukranian forces were "actors", something they've said before as well.  Apparently in one horrible clip where the Ukranian forces are driving through the town, the Russian's spot a "corpse actor" moving their arm.

The Truth or Fake France24 site investigated the Russian claims, and found the video was distorted by rain drops on the camera and the rear side mirror's convex distortion.  I don't recommend watching the video as it is all just too sad.  

Spoiler

It's here: https://www.france24.com/en/tv-shows/truth-or-fake/20220404-debunking-russian-claims-that-bucha-killings-are-staged

 

2 TIm 3:13 - But wicked men and impostors will advance from bad to worse, misleading and being misled

[BLEmom]

Zelensky just blasted the UN security counsel. Saying they should close since they don’t stop Putin. He repeated things they should do and said if they can’t do it, they should dissolve themselves. Let’s see if he will poke the beast enough so they will act!  
This is from the 9011th security counsel meeting. 
 

Oh my, the video he shared looks straight out of nazi times. 😭

Edited April 5, 2022 by BLEmom
Added

[zoebarry]

 

Quote

 

No I haven't seen videos like that and neither would I want to or need to.  Why would any Christian even consider deliberately looking at videos that portray indiscrimate violence and horror. Isn't what is portrayed in the media enough?

 

If this was a reference to me, I didn't say anything that could be construed as taking sides. And yelling at people to get your point across is not particularly pleasant. There are other, kinder, more polite ways to counsel people, if that is your intention.  Otherwise, your comment is just judgemental.

 

 

I don’t think anyone here INTENTIONALLY searches out these types of videos, but they are shown on various news outlet sites, so anyone could view such videos unexpectedly.....my point was, that it is out there for all to see.

 

And I was not YELLING, as you accuse me of. Displaying a word in all caps represents EMPHASIS.

 

 

 

[Dhanyel]

The UN will feel the need to be strengthened, I hope these teeth are ready to chew well chewed Babylon the great!

[Sofia]

1 hour ago, BLEmom said:

Zelensky just blasted the UN security counsel. Saying they should close since they don’t stop Putin. He repeated things they should do and said if they can’t do it, they should dissolve themselves. Let’s see if he will poke the beast enough so they will act!  
This is from the 9011th security counsel meeting. 
 

Oh my, the video he shared looks straight out of nazi times. 😭

I’m crying 😭 

please does anyone knows anything about our beloved brothers and sisters??? I pray constantly every hour of the day for them 

I fear the invasion may escalate even further

 

they should have run away when it was easy 😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭

52 minutes ago, Jonadab said:

The UN will feel the need to be strengthened, I hope these teeth are ready to chew well chewed Babylon the great!

Amen 🙏