Peace and Security, Great Tribulation, Armageddon

[Doug]

17 hours ago, Richie said:

Just rephrasing... It is something or a "hint" from instruction. Something like may happen unexpecredly, the time of distress. Still curious and still awaiting for further detail.

 

I can think of only one "hint", if it can even be called that.

 

I haven't been able to find it right now, but I think it was Br Splane.  And he asked rhetorically, "What if Armageddon happens before the Ramapo project is finished?"   "We say, Hallelujah!  Praise Jah".

 

Why would Br Splane say that?  Some might read into that comment, that the GB feel Ramapo may not be completed and put into use before Armageddon.  That's how close we are.  But that's pure speculation.

 

.

[Sofia]

34 minutes ago, Doug said:

I haven't been able to find it right now,

“Jehovah’s Chariot is on the move”

Stephen Lett.

Anual Meeting 2023

 

[Doug]

47 minutes ago, Dolce vita said:

 Threats to world security will increase in intensity, which will trigger the proclamation of world peace at a crucial moment.

The risk: that people will be fooled by the power of the proclamation and undoubtedly the urgency to make it. This is the reason why I find, for my par, that the prophecy which emphasizes that we are going to go towards the worst is entirely compatible with the prophecy of  Thessalonians.

 

Just to add a thought:   I feel the people (the clay, but worldwide) will become increasingly disgusted with their elected leaders.  Utter failures.   It's always war, war and war.

 

It's an election year for the KOTS.   That's when politicians make grand promises of a bright and prosperous future.

Well, the clay will be so disgusted with these politicians and their feckless leadership, that the politicians will really need to  go overboard with their assurance of peace and security.  Another big lie on the campaign trail.  But fulfillment of prophesy!!!!

[chuck83]

38 minutes ago, Doug said:

 

Just to add a thought:   I feel the people (the clay, but worldwide) will become increasingly disgusted with their elected leaders.  Utter failures.   It's always war, war and war.

 

It's an election year for the KOTS.   That's when politicians make grand promises of a bright and prosperous future.

Well, the clay will be so disgusted with these politicians and their feckless leadership, that the politicians will really need to  go overboard with their assurance of peace and security.  Another big lie on the campaign trail.  But fulfillment of prophesy!!!!

At least 64 elections globally plus UN and EU elections. It’s a big year. Global citizens will have a lot to protest over.
 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_elections_in_2024

https://time.com/6550920/world-elections-2024/

 

[Michał]

I found interesting in this article that the situation WILL GET worse before it gets better.
So… where is room for the P&S announcement here?
Am I missing something here?
 
Shouldnt we expect a bit of improvement before BTG gets destroyed?
 

I understand it that “the situation will get worse” during the great tribulation before it gets better under Gods Kingdom.


(Tapatalk)

[Landon1285]

32 minutes ago, Michał said:

I understand it that “the situation will get worse” during the great tribulation before it gets better under Gods Kingdom.


(Tapatalk)

Yup that was going to be my response as well. Friends have thought for years that before the call of peace and security human issues would be resolved like cancer or hunger. But that isn't contingent upon the prophecy about peace and security. It just may well be what people will use - these examples of things getting better-as evidence against us to say that we don't need God's kingdom. 

 

We will be the only ones preaching about the destruction of this world while everyone else is saying peace and security. 

[Sofia]

Jeremiah and Ezequiel mentioned that the religious leaders the prophets would lie by saying there would be peace when there was no peace.

saying peace was comming from the prophets that mislead Israel.

So…

You all please correct my thoughts:

could it be… that the religious leaders feel they are in security thinking that UN protects freedom of religion and that nothing wrong will happen to them.

In this case the peace and security feeling would be felt from religious leaders (Rev.18:7 …”For she keeps saying in her heart: ‘I sit as queen, and I am not a widow, and I will never see mourning“)

So btg feels safe. Feels secure. (western laws protect mostly religion freedom. most nations respects the pope for instance.)

then all of sudden … destruction comes upon her.

 

When they think themselves most secure, they are then in the greatest danger; when they are most off their guard, then the crisis comes.

 

 

Edited January 31 by Sofia

[Richie]

5 hours ago, Dolce vita said:

The risk: that people will be fooled by the power of the proclamation and undoubtedly the urgency to make it. This is the reason why I find, for my par, that the prophecy which emphasizes that we are going to go towards the worst is entirely compatible with the prophecy of  Thessalonians.

I love this part...

[Dhanyel]

I have the impression that there will be a great battle between nations, like a third world war, and then people and religious and political leaders will call for peace and security. At least the scenario suggests something similar. In any case, we will have to wait and see what the world scenario indicates and what the outcome will be. And, most importantly, what Jehovah will reveal to us through the faithful and discreet slave.

The Bible did not foretell any specific war that we are seeing today. However, it did foretell the rampant warfare that is marking our time and is taking “peace away from the earth.”—Revelation 6:4.

[Doug]

2 hours ago, Sofia said:

 

You all please correct my thoughts:

could it be… that the religious leaders feel they are in security thinking that UN protects freedom of religion and that nothing wrong will happen to them.

In this case the peace and security feeling would be felt from religious leaders (Rev.18:7 …”For she keeps saying in her heart: ‘I sit as queen, and I am not a widow, and I will never see mourning“)

So btg feels safe. Feels secure. (western laws protect mostly religion freedom. most nations respects the pope for instance.)

then all of sudden … destruction comes upon her.

 

 

I would LOVE to see it happen this way  .    .     .

[Richie]

3 hours ago, Sofia said:

Jeremiah and Ezequiel mentioned that the religious leaders the prophets would lie by saying there would be peace when there was no peace.

saying peace was comming from the prophets that mislead Israel.

So…

You all please correct my thoughts:

could it be… that the religious leaders feel they are in security thinking that UN protects freedom of religion and that nothing wrong will happen to them.

In this case the peace and security feeling would be felt from religious leaders (Rev.18:7 …”For she keeps saying in her heart: ‘I sit as queen, and I am not a widow, and I will never see mourning“)

So btg feels safe. Feels secure. (western laws protect mostly religion freedom. most nations respects the pope for instance.)

then all of sudden … destruction comes upon her.

 

When they think themselves most secure, they are then in the greatest danger; when they are most off their guard, then the crisis comes.

 

 

That is another possibility... The Book of Jeremiah 8:11 also mentions these words,

And they try to heal the breakdown of the daughter of my people lightly, saying,

“There is peace! There is peace!” When there is no peace.

They try to say there is a peace even there is no peace at all. If our time has the same scenario, comforters of this world are trying to misled people that there is a hope for peace even though the world is heading to disaster.

 

[Tia]

 

 

https://nypost.com/2024/01/27/news/convoy-claiming-to-be-gods-army-heading-to-texas-to-protest-border-crisis/

 

A group whose members have described themselves as “God’s army” is heading to the southern border to protest record numbers of migrants illegally crossing over from Mexico. 

Organizers with “Take Our Border Back” say they want to stand up to “globalists” who they believe are conspiring to let migrants illegally flood the country.

 

“This is a biblical, monumental moment that’s been put together by God,” one organizer said during a planning call, according to Vice News. 

“We are besieged on all sides by dark forces of evil,” said another. 

The group is planning a convoy, set to leave Virginia Beach on Monday for Texas, followed by three rallies on Feb. 3 at sites near Eagle Pass, Texas; Yuma, Arizona; and San Ysidro, California. 

 

[Paulo]

18 hours ago, Sofia said:

I found interesting in this article that the situation WILL GET worse before it gets better.

So… where is room for the P&S announcement here? 🤔

Am I missing something here?

 

Shouldnt we expect a bit of improvement before BTG gets destroyed?

 

 

I could think of at least 3 possibilities to have room for P&S:

 

1

The GB interpretation that Paul is prophesying an event not yet foreseen that will be false if made by humans, or will require Divine intervention to be true. We will need patience to wait and see.

 

2

Paul, as a contemporary of the Apostles of Jesus, and having had for sure deep and long conversations with them, including a lot that probably was not written in the Bible, is quoting Luke 17:26-29 (Matthew 24:37-39) and thus P&S refers to life as normal, at least in some corners of the world at a time. In that case, as usually people ask for what they do not have, people would cry or demand for P&S

 

3

Paul, as a scholar of the Hebrew-Aramaic texts, is quoting Daniel 8:25 and 11:21, and thus P&S refers to a proclamation made, in the past, that started a period of 30 years, that already ended, and affected the world events and our preaching.

[Sofia]

42 minutes ago, Paulo said:

We will need patience to wait and see.

Oh yes! 
one thing is for sure: false religion will be banned.

no matter how the peace and security announcement is made.

It’s good to keep on the watch !! We will soon witness this happening 🤩

[Dolce vita]

1 minute ago, Sofia said:

Oh oui! 
Une chose est sûre : la fausse religion sera interdite.

quelle que soit la manière dont l’annonce de paix et de sécurité est faite.

C'est bien de veiller !! Nous serons bientôt témoins de cela 🤩

It's so, so close... May Jehovah give us life to live this great day! 🥰🥰

[LindaViktoria]

I think this was interesting in Watchtower 81 11/15 paragraph 19 it says:

 

Of this we can be certain: The cry of “Peace and security!”—whatever form it takes—does not mean that the underlying condition of this world will have been reversed. Nor does it mean that the nations will disarm or give up their hostile attitudes. “‘There is no peace,’ my God has said, ‘for the wicked ones.’” (Isa. 57:21) It is just that, for the moment, world leaders, out of desperation or because of seeing some selfish advantage in pursuing some new policies, will cry “Peace and security!” in a more pronounced way than before.

[Dhanyel]

Farmers' anger spreads in Europe, governments promise help

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/angry-farmers-descend-brussels-take-protest-eu-summit-2024-02-01/

 

What's going on there my brothers 

[jwnate]

22 hours ago, Doug said:

 

I can think of only one "hint", if it can even be called that.

 

I haven't been able to find it right now, but I think it was Br Splane.  And he asked rhetorically, "What if Armageddon happens before the Ramapo project is finished?"   "We say, Hallelujah!  Praise Jah".

 

Why would Br Splane say that?  Some might read into that comment, that the GB feel Ramapo may not be completed and put into use before Armageddon.  That's how close we are.  But that's pure speculation.

 

.

Br Splane and Br Morris have both made statements like that in recent years, but I don't know that we can really read anything into it. In the 1941 dedication talk for the dormitory building at Kingdom Farm, Br Rutherford made a very similar statement: even though the end was close, it was okay to spend the time and effort on the construction, because it could very possibly also be used after Armageddon. Obviously, it's been 80 years since he said that, and the organization stopped using Kingdom Farm for anything substantial decades ago. We just don't know the day or the hour. https://archive.org/details/1941-1944Consolation/page/n19/mode/2up?view=theater 

 

[Dolce vita]

1 hour ago, Dhanyel said:

La colère des agriculteurs se propage en Europe, les gouvernements promettent de l'aide

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/angry-farmers-descend-brussels-take-protest-eu-summit-2024-02-01/

 

Que se passe-t-il là-bas mes frères 

French farmers are no longer able to survive, and the reasons are multifactorial, Daniel. Climate change is putting a strain on harvests. They are strangled by European standards in administrative matters, they are unable to sell their stocks due to competition from other countries which do not have to respect the standards imposed by the Europe. For example, because of the inflation, the French consumer will prefer to buy Spanish products which are not subject to the same requirements and which are therefore less expensive, even if they are of minor quality as regard to local producers. On average, due to the situation, a farmer commits suicide every two days in France, but perhaps elsewhere it is even worse. Aid to Ukraine also raises many eyebrows. All this is spreading like wildfire in Europe.

[vern]

Darker side of the world gain the control they been wanting and declare thier peace.

 

The darker side of the world fail and the lighter looking side declare thier peace.... Not Jehovah.s or Christs peace.

 

Jehovah declare's He and the kingdom will be a thief

[coolbrz731]

What I wonder is how the declaration of Peace and Security, or Peace and Safety will go from the average man on the street going "[Insert word here] propaganda!  I don't buy it!" to "I can't believe it!  They actually pulled it off!"  Because the proclamation is supposed to mislead the entire world, even possibly misleading some of the spiritually weaker ones(that's the only way I can figure out how a JW could be misled by that proclamation).  

Edited February 1 by coolbrz731

[Doug]

1 hour ago, coolbrz731 said:

 Because the proclamation is supposed to mislead the entire world, even possibly misleading some of the spiritually weaker ones(that's the only way I can figure out how a JW could be misled by that proclamation).  

 

Which tells us it will be a deception like nothing we have seen or experienced before.  Satan's Grand Finale.

[Doug]

4 hours ago, LindaViktoria said:

I think this was interesting in Watchtower 81 11/15 paragraph 19 it says:

 It is just that, for the moment, world leaders, out of desperation or because of seeing some selfish advantage in pursuing some new policies, will cry “Peace and security!” in a more pronounced way than before.

 

This scenario works well during an election year.  And 2024 is a bigger election year globally than most years.

[Dustparticle]

25 minutes ago, Doug said:

 

This scenario works well during an election year.  And 2024 is a bigger election year globally than most years.

I’m voting for Jesus, if not, Jehovah or both of them. https://www.jw.org/en/library/series/more-topics/people-losing-trust-in-politicians/

[Landon1285]

1 hour ago, Doug said:

 

Which tells us it will be a deception like nothing we have seen or experienced before.  Satan's Grand Finale.

Sophistry aka The Big Lie.