GB update #2 2023

[Doug]

8 hours ago, Parale said:

 

Unlikely, the 1992 date references when they would needed to be anointed by (rather than simply be baptised by) in order to be included with the second part of the overlapping "this generation".

 

It has been confirmed that Mark Sanderson is in the second part of "this generation". I suspect, subject to confirmation, that none of the last three brothers appointed to the Governing Body - Kenneth Cook, Jeffrey Winder, and Gage Fleegle - are part of "this generation," but as I said, nothing is confirmed.

 

https://jwtalk.net/topic/35497-the-overlap-in-this-generation/page/5/#comment-913258

 

Actually, the 1992 marker is thought to be the year the first group had run out of gas.  Although it's possible that there could have been another anointed one who lived past the death of Fred Franz, it's Br. Franz that they are pinning as the last of the first group.

 

The second group would have had a substantial overlap with the first group.  I suppose if one began partaking during 1992, that one would technically be counted in the second group with an overlap of less than a year.  But the impression is that of a considerable overlap between the two groups.

[Pabo]

5 hours ago, Jwanon said:

I had no idea we don't officially say Turkey anymore

 

4 hours ago, Parale said:

 

Yes inteeresting, I think JW.org have only just caught up?...

 

https://jwtalk.net/topic/54212-earthquakes-in-one-place-after-another/page/78/#comment-915622

 

 

 

 

Actually a lot of news and media outlets was very slow on this and still saying Turkey. However, since this terrible event, a lot of them finally caught up with the times.

 

[Michał]

5 hours ago, WilliamChew said:

 

I used to wonder why a country would call itself turkey

i guess the name of the country was first, then the animal, and finally the other expressions. 

[GeordieGirl]

14 hours ago, MullumMiss said:

I was married in 1986, does that count for anything😎 

Haha! Me too. 

Edited March 14, 2023 by GeordieGirl

[Parale]

8 hours ago, Doug said:

The second group would have had a substantial overlap with the first group.  I suppose if one began partaking during 1992, that one would technically be counted in the second group with an overlap of less than a year.  But the impression is that of a considerable overlap between the two groups.

 

Bro Fred Franz finished his earthly course on 22 December 1992, right at the end of 1992.

 

As we have previously discussed:

 

Note that Bro Splane said "Someone would have had to been anointed before 1992", and yes, that would indicate a member of the second group could have been anointed as recently as 1991. Interestingly Bro Fred Franz actually finished his earthly course right at the end of 1992 - on the morning of 22 December 1992 - therefore Bro Splane is perhaps (?) indicating a 12-month overlap between Group 1 and Group 2 of 'this generation' as being a 'reasonable' overlap.

 

The youngest confirmed 'Group 2' member on the Governing Body is believed to be Mark Sanderson who was appointed in September 2012. His appearance in his High School Yearbooks in 1981 and 1982 would indicate that he was born in 1965 (+/- one year). If this is the case, he would have been 27 years old in 1992, and would have needed to have been partaking before this.

 

https://jwtalk.net/topic/35497-the-overlap-in-this-generation/page/5/#comment-913239

Edited March 14, 2023 by Parale

[Parale]

4 hours ago, Michał said:

i guess the name of the country was first, then the animal,

 

Apparently so....

 

Why A Turkey Is Called A Turkey

https://www.npr.org/2008/11/27/97541602/why-a-turkey-is-called-a-turkey

[MullumMiss]

10 hours ago, Parale said:

 

Apparently so....

 

Why A Turkey Is Called A Turkey

https://www.npr.org/2008/11/27/97541602/why-a-turkey-is-called-a-turkey

 

[Michał]

10 hours ago, Parale said:

 

Apparently so....

 

Why A Turkey Is Called A Turkey

https://www.npr.org/2008/11/27/97541602/why-a-turkey-is-called-a-turkey

From This article:

 

Quote

In Poland, "Inyczka"— again "bird from India."

 

Well, it’s incorrect, the correct name indyk or (much less common) for the female bird indyczka. Still, it comes from the word Indie, how present day America was called 5 centuries ago. 
 

Anyway, getting back on topic, I need to rewatch this update to practice the pronunciation of the new name.

[GeordieGirl]

It is logical, to me at least, for brothers new to the Governing Body to be members of the other sheep, and who will be trained and ready when the anointed are taken to heaven so everything will carry on smoothly as before.

 

If all members of the Governing Body were of the anointed class at that time, then when they leave the earth to join Jesus in heaven, there would be no Governing Body to guide us through the remaining time of the GT before Armageddon.

 

 

[Hope]

27 minutes ago, GeordieGirl said:

It is logical, to me at least, for brothers new to the Governing Body to be members of the other sheep, and who will be trained and ready when the anointed are taken to heaven so everything will carry on smoothly as before.

 

If all members of the Governing Body were of the anointed class at that time, then when they leave the earth to join Jesus in heaven, there would be no Governing Body to guide us through the remaining time of the GT before Armageddon.

 

 

 

The two new brothers are not anointed?? 😮 

[GeordieGirl]

4 minutes ago, Hope said:

 

The two new brothers are not anointed?? 😮 

I don't know for sure but there was a discussion further up this topic that was discussing the subject. Have a look at Parale's comment a few posts up. (I can't tell the post number because I'm using my phone and get limited post information). 

[Hope]

9 minutes ago, GeordieGirl said:

I don't know for sure but there was a discussion further up this topic that was discussing the subject. Have a look at Parale's comment a few posts up. (I can't tell the post number because I'm using my phone and get limited post information). 

Okay, I scanned.. didn't see any confirmation.  We'll see.. 😉

 

[GeordieGirl]

30 minutes ago, Hope said:

Okay, I scanned.. didn't see any confirmation.  We'll see.. 😉

 

Just to confirm, I didn't actually say that they weren't anointed, I merely said that it would be logical, to me, for them not to be. But that's just my opinion. ❤️

Edited March 15, 2023 by GeordieGirl

[ecok]

1 hour ago, GeordieGirl said:

It is logical, to me at least, for brothers new to the Governing Body to be members of the other sheep, and who will be trained and ready when the anointed are taken to heaven so everything will carry on smoothly as before.

 

If all members of the Governing Body were of the anointed class at that time, then when they leave the earth to join Jesus in heaven, there would be no Governing Body to guide us through the remaining time of the GT before Armageddon.

 

 

The Governing Body has to be of the anointed. If any member were not, it would be a huge doctrinal change for our organization & there would be talks, and Watchtower articles explaining the change. But that won't happen, because the Governing Body is the Faithful and Discreet Slave which is made up only of spirit anointed Christians. See the link to our new publication Enjoy Life Forever lesson 54.1 which states: All members of the Governing Body are spirit-anointed Christians, who look forward to joining Christ in his heavenly Kingdom when their life on earth is over.

 

https://www.jw.org/finder?wtlocale=E&docid=1102021254&srctype=wol&srcid=share&par=5

 

They did not say that the 2 new members are of the anointed because it is a given. Also, it is a private matter that anointed ones do not talk about. Just like it would be rude for anyone to ask them if they are of the anointed or how they know, when they knew, etc. 

 

The helpers to the Governing Body are the ones who will take the lead on earth during the Great Tribulation once the Anointed all receive their heavenly reward. 

Edited March 15, 2023 by ecok

[BLEmom]

This article seems to indicate that the faithful slave is the governing body and thus are all anointed. 
https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2013533?q=faithful+slave&p=par

[Hinata]

1 hour ago, GeordieGirl said:

It is logical, to me at least, for brothers new to the Governing Body to be members of the other sheep, and who will be trained and ready when the anointed are taken to heaven so everything will carry on smoothly as before.

 

If all members of the Governing Body were of the anointed class at that time, then when they leave the earth to join Jesus in heaven, there would be no Governing Body to guide us through the remaining time of the GT before Armageddon.

 

 

 

It is our current understanding that all members of the Governing Body, that is, the Faithful and Discreet Slaves, be anointed ones.

 

*** lff lesson 54 point 1 The Role of “the Faithful and Discreet Slave” ***
Jehovah has always used a man or a small group of men to give direction to his people. (Malachi 2:7; Hebrews 1:1) After Jesus’ death, the apostles and elders in Jerusalem took the lead. (Acts 15:2) Following that pattern, today a small group of elders—the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses—provides spiritual food and directs the preaching work. This group is “the faithful and discreet slave whom [Jesus] appointed.” (Matthew 24:45a) All members of the Governing Body are spirit-anointed Christians, who look forward to joining Christ in his heavenly Kingdom when their life on earth is over.
https://www.jw.org/finder?wtlocale=E&docid=1102021254&srctype=wol&srcid=share&par=5

 

However, we do have helpers to the Governing Body, to which I don't think there are any requirements for them to be anointed. It is possible that after they are taken up to the heaven during the great tribulation, the current helpers to the Governing Body may receive the task of directing the earthly organisation, similar to what you say. We could say they are receiving a sort of training right now. Of course, this is just speculation. After all, we do not know what exactly may happen or what kind of direction we may receive.

 

Edited March 15, 2023 by Hinata

[jwhess]

Those who are "trained and ready" to take over when the anointed go to heaven are the "helpers" to the GB.  By far and large they are of the other sheep.  They are on the same committees and work with the anointed every day.

 

When they were still in Brooklyn, Br. Morris once mentioned to us that he told the "boys on the 10th floor" (helpers to the GB) to keep up the pace because they (the GB) would not be here much longer.

[GeordieGirl]

4 minutes ago, jwhess said:

Those who are "trained and ready" to take over when the anointed go to heaven are the "helpers" to the GB.  By far and large they are of the other sheep.  They are on the same committees and work with the anointed every day.

 

When they were still in Brooklyn, Br. Morris once mentioned to us that he told the "boys on the 10th floor" (helpers to the GB) to keep up the pace because they (the GB) would not be here much longer.

Thank you John.  I was in no way trying to run ahead of the chariot but was taking my thoughts from other conversations discussed on here, particularly some of those regarding the overlap of the anointed.

 

It is my understanding that those selected to the Governing Body have worked for sometime on one or other of the helper commitees and probably continue in that same role after becoming a Governing Body member.  Am I wrong in thinking this?

 

However, assuming that is so until I am corrected otherwise, and the majority of the helpers are the other sheep, what happens if they need more governing body members and there are no more helpers who are anointed?

Or maybe, Brothers Winder and Fleegle are the last two anointed on any of the committees and the last two who will ever be needed as GB members. (I am not saying any of this is so. They're just my thoughts, my maybes and my perhaps)

 

The reason I said what I did about new GB members not being anointed was because, in my mind, I was trying to project forward to that, however long, space of time between the remaining anointed being taken to heaven, and Armageddon, and wondering if we would need a collective body to continue directing the various committees. If that were so, then the GB of that time, or whatever it may be called then, could be made up of other sheep.

 

 

 

[Doug]

24 minutes ago, GeordieGirl said:

 was taking my thoughts from other conversations discussed on here, particularly some of those regarding the overlap of the anointed.

 

The reason I said what I did about new GB members not being anointed was because, in my mind, I was trying to project forward  ~ wondering if we would need a collective body to continue directing the various committees. If that were so, then the GB of that time, or whatever it may be called then, could be made up of other sheep.

 

 

The interesting thing about "this generation" , to me, is that it doesn't include all of the anointed.  Our understanding is that "this generation" of which Jesus spoke, the generation that would "by no means pass away until all these things happen", began with those already baptized and anointed in October 1914, and followed by those who were baptized and anointed no later than 1992, overlapping the remnant of the first group.

 

So, there would be latter-day anointed ones who could possibly serve on the GB but not be a part of "this generation" Jesus was talking about.

 

As we read the life stories of brothers recently appointed to the GB, the date of their baptism is mentioned, but never the date when they began partaking.  If we knew when they received their heavenly hope, as indicated by partaking, we could sort of figure out if they might be a part of the second group.

 

On the idea of who will be in charge when all the anointed have received their reward and are no longer with us; well, Jesus will be in charge.  And he will have the trained helpers and the Branch Committee brothers all across the globe to work through.

[GeordieGirl]

21 minutes ago, Doug said:

 

On the idea of who will be in charge when all the anointed have received their reward and are no longer with us; well, Jesus will be in charge.  And he will have the trained helpers and the Branch Committee brothers all across the globe to work through.

 

That won't really happen till after Armageddon though. That's why I said 'between the time the anointed receive their heavenly reward and Armageddon'. Obviously if it is only a matter of days or even a few weeks it will be a moot issue really. But if its months or longer, there may be a body who oversees the work in a similar way to the slave now.

 

None of it matters though! Jehovah and Jesus already know how long it will be and have everything under control. It's just me being a nosy human and having a speculative conversation. 🙃

 

 

[Amygdala]

It was so lovely to see the 2 new brothers on the GB interviewed. You really get the sense that these, and all members of the GB, are humble men. They have faithful, humble, long records of service, and don’t come across as feeling superior to others in any sense. They were able to be used by Jehovah and it is lovely to see them continue to humbly serve Him and although will become well known, humbly serve Jehovah‘s people. 

Edited March 15, 2023 by Woanders

[Parale]

10 hours ago, GeordieGirl said:

10 hours ago, Hope said:

 

The two new brothers are not anointed?? 😮 

I don't know for sure but there was a discussion further up this topic that was discussing the subject. Have a look at Parale's comment a few posts up. (I can't tell the post number because I'm using my phone and get limited post information). 

 

I think there maybe some confusion and mixup between simply "being anointed" and "being part of 'this generation'".

 

ALL brothers on the 'governing body'/'Governing Body' have been, and currently are, of the anointed and partake of the emblems, with one exception - Hayden C. Covington (governing body from 1940 to 1945) - who was of the other sheep.

 

There are four 'groups' of anointed

 

Group A : Anointed and finished earthly course before 1914. This would include all the faithful first century Christians, as well as faithful modern day Christians who finished their earthly course before 1914. These ones are not part of 'this generation'.

 

Group B : Anointed before 1914, but finished their earthly course after 1914. These ones make up the First Group of 'this generation'. Includes Joseph Rutherford; A. H. Macmillan; W. E. Van Amburgh; and Fred W. Franz who finished his earthly course in December 1992, aged 99.

 

Group C : Anointed before all those in Group B had finished their earthly course (i.e. anointed before 1992) - they overlapped with Group B. These ones make up the Second Group of 'this generation'. Includes Nathan Knorr; Lyman Swingle; Grant Suiter; Milton Henschel; George Gangas; Carl Kline; John Barr; and Albert Schroeder. All of the 2015 members of the Governing Body are also part of ‘this generation’ (Mark Sanderson; Gerrit Lösch; Samuel Herd; Stephen Lett; David Splane; Geoffrey Jackson; and Anthony Morris III.)

 

Group D : Anointed after all those in Group B had finished their earthly course (i.e. anointed after 1992). These ones are not part of 'this generation'.

 

Therefore, while it has been confirmed that Mark Sanderson is in the second part of "this generation" (i.e. in Group 'C' above), I suspect, subject to confirmation, that none of the last three brothers appointed to the Governing Body - Kenneth Cook, Jeffrey Winder, and Gage Fleegle - are part of "this generation," (i.e. they are in Group 'D' above, they are still anointed and partake, but anointed after 1992), but as I said, while nothing is confirmed, we do know they are all anointed and partake.

 

https://jwtalk.net/topic/35497-the-overlap-in-this-generation/page/5/#comment-913258

Edited March 15, 2023 by Parale

[MullumMiss]

Personally I don’t understand why the topic of whether these new GB members are of, or not of “this generation.  The fact that they are anointed already and are then appointed as GB makes me appreciate Jesus’ oversight of his congregation at this time.  Why the need to discuss the logistics of them not being “this generation”.  We already know we are close to the end.  We also know there are only a few more prophecies to be fulfilled before Armageddon.  The interview cemented Jesus care for us by appointing these men.  

[jayrtom]

1 hour ago, MullumMiss said:

Personally I don’t understand why the topic of whether these new GB members are of, or not of “this generation.  The fact that they are anointed already and are then appointed as GB makes me appreciate Jesus’ oversight of his congregation at this time.  Why the need to discuss the logistics of them not being “this generation”.  We already know we are close to the end.  We also know there are only a few more prophecies to be fulfilled before Armageddon.  The interview cemented Jesus care for us by appointing these men.  

You're right, it shouldn't have any bearing on them being of the GB if thei're from this generation or not...

 

But, interestingly, on the video about this generation, Br Splane said that "all of the GB members are from this generation".. He didn't need to say it...but he did...

[Dhanyel]

David H. Splane: Close to the End of This System of Things

https://www.jw.org/en/library/videos/#en/mediaitems/StudioTalks/pub-jwban_201509_1_VIDEO