2025 GB Update #5 - Putting to rest issues on “Higher” Education

[Bob]

I am somewhat uncomfortable with many brothers saying this update is nothing and nothing has changed from before. Personally, I think it’s a huge u-turn and that’s not a bad thing in my eyes.

 

In the late 60s, the organization taught that college education was useless because Armageddon would come before young people would finish.

 

Since then, while it wasn’t banned, it was strongly discouraged. Brothers could be removed as elders if they sent their children to college.

 

As of last week, it’s a “personal decision” and elders can’t judge. 
 

So a LOT has changed, and I think for the better. 

[trottigy]

5 hours ago, Bob said:

I am somewhat uncomfortable with many brothers saying this update is nothing and nothing has changed from before. Personally, I think it’s a huge u-turn and that’s not a bad thing in my eyes.

 

In the late 60s, the organization taught that college education was useless because Armageddon would come before young people would finish.

 

Since then, while it wasn’t banned, it was strongly discouraged. Brothers could be removed as elders if they sent their children to college.

 

As of last week, it’s a “personal decision” and elders can’t judge. 
 

So a LOT has changed, and I think for the better. 

 

An elder still could be removed if he is encouraging his family and others to focus on making more money and becoming successful in this system - even at the cost of their spirituality.

 

That did not change 

[YayaMichelle]

1 hour ago, trottigy said:

 

An elder still could be removed if he is encouraging his family and others to focus on making more money and becoming successful in this system - even at the cost of their spirituality.

 

That did not change 

 

But  wouldn’t this be harder to prove now after the update? What would now be a good evidence that an elder  beyond reasonable doubt is “encouraging his family and others to focus on making more money at the cost of his spirituality”.  An eyewitness? Or  Someone reporting him that he gave that advice to someone? He could easily refute/deny that.
 

Before the update last Friday, an elder father sending his child to college is already a sufficient factual evidence across many congregations globally (NOT ALL) to make him step down as an elder. 
 

AFTER the update last Friday, it appears like sending the kid to university per se is no longer acceptable as an evidence as it has gained immunity from “judging”.

not sure if i made sense. Maybe not.  sorry.

Edited 17 hours ago by YayaMichelle
toned it down

[Andrey]

2 hours ago, trottigy said:

 

An elder still could be removed if he is encouraging his family and others to focus on making more money and becoming successful in this system - even at the cost of their spirituality.

 

That did not change 

 

I imagine if the brothers had made this statement change in May or April. Usually in June or July there are entrance tests (exams) to universities. How many parents and children would have declared that their goal is to put career and wealth first? Today, the role of brothers is to discuss the pros and cons, but not to interfere with making a choice.

Edited 16 hours ago by Andrey

[TheKid23]

8 hours ago, Michał said:

Lets waits for update #6 about hair colors 

 

I don’t know why but some years ago here it was popular for a bit older woman like 50/60/70 (in and out of congregation) to have purple hair. This fashion (literally) faded away. 

We have an older sister who has purple hair 😅

[Ludwika]

8 hours ago, Michał said:

Lets waits for update #6 about hair colors 

 

I don’t know why but some years ago here it was popular for a bit older woman like 50/60/70 (in and out of congregation) to have purple hair. This fashion (literally) faded away. 

While I was still at school I had a part time job as shampoo girl at a local hairdressers, and all the little old ladies came in for a pink or blue rinse. 

[Eejay]

2 hours ago, trottigy said:

An elder still could be removed if he is encouraging his family and others to focus on making more money and becoming successful in this system - even at the cost of their spirituality.

This wouldn't necessarily be connected with engaging in "additional education". It could be anything that was causing a deliberate neglect of spiritual matters.

 

This change of emphasis to making "additional education" choices a matter for a personal decision is part of the growing up process we are being encouraged to follow in recent times. As Br. Lett illustrated in his update #4, we do not expect capable adults to be still holding their mothers hand to cross the road do we?

 

It reminds me of:

1. Hebrews 5:14. As individuals, we have been trained to recognise danger and in the case of "additional education". The practical principles and reasoning Br. Splane discussed were "Keep a good spiritual routine, protect your thinking, manage your time carefully, and choose your associates wisely".

2: 2Cor.1:24. Good advice for elders, particularly the study note. It is interesting that the update emphasised the need to rely on Jehovah through prayer, and also for parents to be the principle guides for minors in this matter. Elders may provide advice in weighing pros and cons, for adults or for parents of minors, in making decisions about "additional education", but as Br. Splane pointed out clearly "no Christian —including the elders— should judge a fellow Christian’s personal decision on this matter."

 

This is a welcome development in our Christian course. It assigns dignity and respect to those who need to makes personal choices in these matters, providing the right kind of support. It frees elders up to be concentrating their energies and example on strengthening the "sheep" to continue developing their trust in Jehovah to provide while they focuss on the ingathering of "rightly disp[osed ones at this time.  And also, it really demonstrates how Jesus, as the Head of the congregation, is actively shepherding his people in these last days. He is fulfilling his promise: "Come to me all you who are toiling and loaded down, and I will refresh you" Matt.11:28.

[Tsheppar]

I waited a few pages before I said anything.

 

I dont have a horse in this race.

 

I am  a life long witness who as soon as I got away from a florescent lit highschool classroom, you couldn't PAY me for extra education!  Aint NO WAY  I was going to college. No interest. No desire. Nada. 

Now dont get me wrong...I love learning. I went to work for a witness carpenter and learned boo- koos of knowledge. I got  paid ( minimum wage)  for learning how to build a home, and that  has served me well through the years. I got paid for learning. 

 

 

My brother ( who was raised as  a witness,  but never took to it,  and certainly never baptized) , this premise of no  college education was a real hangup with him. He wanted to be a millionaire. And in the 1980s that was a real big idea to him. 

  Years later , he eventually went to a community college out of spite I think.   

 I , on the other,   hand took a different route . Unlike my brother , I really don't care much about money, my  faithful witness sister  is the same. 

 I went  to bethel and that was a grand education !

 Amazingly , as I was what was considered "broke" ...I somehow traveled the world.  Go figure.

 

 My brother , chasing riches. Never really left our hometown.

 

   I know brothers who graduated  valedictorian, refused college and  struggled financially. 

 

 I know brothers who went to college and  are weathy.

 

 I know brothers who went to college and are  flat broke. 

 

  I know brothers who barely have any education , mow lawns  ,and  are very  wealthy.

 

  Not going to college is not the answer to lifes problems. 

 Yes it was looked down upon ,lets not deny it.  

 The pendulum swings both ways. Sometimes it works. Sometimes it doesn't. 

 Ive personally seen it go both ways. 

 Any stigma has thus been removed. Yay! 

 

People can do as they choose before Jehovah. Broke or rich. Jehovah can bless. 

College is not the answer to life's problems. 

Your relationship with Jehovah is the answer. 

Ok. Im going pay some bills now. With money I dont have. Gosh! Maybe a university education would have fixed this! 🤣

[Ludwika]

9 hours ago, Lance said:

I have found rest for my soul in this old system.. a choice

Yes, this. Me too. If I hadn't come into the truth all those years ago, where would I be now? The world is a cruel and terrible place, filled with agitated and anxious people. Instead, I've found safety and protection and peace.

I regret nothing when it's come to following directions from Jehovah's organization over the years, it was advice for it's time.

Those who look back regretfully are sadly looking back through rose tinted glasses, as they say. Universities were hot beds for political activism in many countries over those decades. They promoted, and still do, God dishonoring theories and behavior, it was shark infested waters. 

You could get good jobs that paid well without putting yourself into that environment. 

Now almost every entry level position requires a degree of some sort. It's a different world. But there's options to get further education in many ways these days, and lots of brothers and sisters have taken advantage of such opportunities. 

[Andrey]

I have great respect for all the brothers and sisters who put Jehovah first, serve in Bethel, enter the Theocratic Schools (Gilead, SKE), take up pioneer service, or who have a pioneer spirit. May Jehovah's name always be sanctified by this. Praise be to Jehovah!

 

The question of which education is the best is not an acute one in the discussions on the JWTalk forum and in the congregations of Jehovah's Witnesses. The question is always about freedom of choice, the conscience of parents and children, as well as condemnation and a critical approach towards those who have chosen higher education. The question is about the excessive zeal of some appointed brothers who can impose their point of view that education is a sin. I will say that in our area, this was condemned and stopped immediately, as soon as the brothers found out that parents and their children decided to get higher education. In the congregations, they could create conditions as if this person violates the theocratic order and does not follow the leadership of the Organization. 

 

I have a question, is higher education a grave sin along with murder, adultery, theft, fraud, homosexuality, alcoholism, drugs, smoking, etc. Is it always clearly visible that a person who has decided to make his choice in favor of higher education is a malicious violator of biblical principles and laws? Why go too far and force a person because someone looks at it critically and despotically? Our task is to help make the right choice, to help young people see the priorities in spiritual life. But not to interfere in personal life, not to judge. 

 

It is only possible to determine that a person in the congregation is violating Jehovah's laws over time, which is evident from his behavior in the world and in the congregation, and from the topics he begins to discuss among brothers and sisters.

 

“However, let none of you suffer as a murderer or a thief or a wrongdoer or a busybody in other people’s matters.”—1 Peter 4:15

 

When brothers are trained in schools, they are taught to respect personal life, to trust, to gently and kindly instruct, to help make the right choice, because God's training is the most important thing in our life, the life of a dedicated brother and sister. But, do not impose, do not force, do not dominate, do not condemn, do not look for those who will also take his personal opinion to show that he is right. If Jehovah gives us the right to choose, then we need to learn this too.

 

“I take the heavens and the earth as witnesses against you today that I have put life and death before you, the blessing and the curse; and you must choose life so that you may live, you and your descendants, by loving Jehovah your God, by listening to his voice, and by sticking to him, for he is your life and by him you will endure a long time in the land that Jehovah swore to give to your forefathers, Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.” — Deuteronomy 30:19, 20

Edited 14 hours ago by Andrey

[Robinson]

13 hours ago, minister159 said:

Just this past week at our midweek meeting the elder conducting the Bible study, made it known very emphatically, that when the Slave "suggests" something, he "does it" as if it were a hard fast rule. He doesn't view it as optional or question it, but just "does it." I gathered that he was implying that's the way we all should be.

 

I've heard similar things from elders that if the slave suggests or recommends something, it's pretty much a rule.  Which I thought was weird, seeing that the word suggest or recommendation implies that there is an option involved. I think these personal views of recommendations and suggestions were just rolled out as law to the congregations.

 

The slave is trying to get us away from that thinking. Don't make hard and fast rules where there are none.

[Robinson]

On 8/22/2025 at 4:08 PM, YayaMichelle said:

Plus the branch needs professional skilled workers. Would be nice for engineers and IT professionals to share those skills in Bethel.  

When you submit your skills for jwhub, the list includes professions that require university degrees, such as marriage counselors, psychologists, psychiatrists, and physicians.

 

I haven't seen a law from the Bible or from the slave saying don't go to college, although it has always been spoken of negatively. I feel that Jehovah doesn't exclude anyone because they have additional education. The bible writer Luke was a physician. Joseph Rutherford was a lawyer. The slave has given us things to think about. I thought about them, and my reasons for going to college had nothing to do with prestige or becoming rich. I needed to be able to provide for myself.

 

I am not rich now. In fact, my brother or sister makes way more money than I ever have, and they don't have a college education. But, my sister also says, "I know I can't leave this job and make what I'm making somewhere else. I'd have to take a huge pay cut." My brother says, "My certifications are only good in this city, which means I'll always have to stay here to find a job with my skills." My additional education at a university has allowed me flexibility that I wasn't able to find before getting a degree. And this has allowed me to pioneer.  I don't regret the decision at all to go to a university. Everyone has to do what's right for their conscience. It's just nice to know the organization has now said that our decision can be made without judgment, even from elders.

[Robinson]

15 hours ago, Patience87 said:

I've lived in California, Kansas, Alaska, etc., and my family can tell you that Midwest is more conservative and some family members were counseled on their choice of dress coming from California where it was normal and acceptable to dress a certain way, for instance wearing a sundress.

 

I experienced it myself moving from California to Alaska. The local brothers and sisters while spiritual people did have opinions, and members of my immediate family received counsel. It is what we do with the counsel that counts. Most in my family I am happy to say accepted the counsel, made changes, and moved on with our lives. Actually I remember being quite embarrassed to have received counsel, so I made sure from them on to dress more modestly I guess you could say.

Yeah. I live in the midwest. In one congregation, one elder told me that I wasn't allowed to wear open-toed shoes on the platform without stockings. I don't understand why. Although I disagreed, i complied with that congregation elder's "rules". I went to another congregation in the same city... there was no problem with my shoes or lack of stockings.

[Rocco]

11 hours ago, Bob said:

I am somewhat uncomfortable with many brothers saying this update is nothing and nothing has changed from before. Personally, I think it’s a huge u-turn and that’s not a bad thing in my eyes.

 

In the late 60s, the organization taught that college education was useless because Armageddon would come before young people would finish.

 

Since then, while it wasn’t banned, it was strongly discouraged. Brothers could be removed as elders if they sent their children to college.

 

As of last week, it’s a “personal decision” and elders can’t judge. 
 

So a LOT has changed, and I think for the better. 

Good points, last week you could have been removed as an elder, this week no longer an issue. 🧐 hmmm 

3 years of past assembly’s where parts almost always included a in depth view of higher education and no need to pursue it. Now it’s additional education and a personal choice.

When viewpoints change like this whose viewpoint are we really seeking? 

[Amygdala]

In general it’s good to keep in mind that not everyone has the same aptitude. When suggesting or discussing any further additional education with children, the parents and not elders, know the strengths and weaknesses of their children. Most responsible heads want their children to keep the kingdom as the foremost thing in their children’s lives, such as pioneering, Bethel, missionary, LDC, etc.

 

So this may or may not include certain types of education. It may not be wise at all for someone to go for a type of schooling to study something that relies heavily on skills in physics, calculus or measurement data if that is not their aptitude, regardless of how short the years may be to study. I know a few even dropping out mid-way of uni. Some who, even after completing some kind of study, unable to work in it that has actually nothing to do with the study itself. It depends on several factors about a person.

 

Counting the cost includes knowing the aptitude, personal habits and motivations, and above all spiritual focus of a young person or even adult. The update showed this decision should be openly discussed and not regulated to just giving it no thought at all. I know of some who suffered losing their children to this world because of a rigid view of uni, which their child wanted for themselves and later did do after leaving the truth sadly. It is not an all or nothing service to Jehovah. It is being whole souled but being balanced in all areas of life, including aptitude, interests, and thinking abilities, while guiding our children spiritually through the mines of this world. That may or may not include further study. But we are not the personal judges for families, nor are we ascetic:
 

 

Quote

Jehovah’s Kingdom—2012 Imitate Jesus’ Example of Watchfulness ***

12 Was Jesus so focused on his work that he was a fanatic or an ascetic? Was he so absorbed in his ministry that he was aloof from the practical needs of families? No, Jesus set a perfect example of balance. He enjoyed life, taking pleasure in happy times with his friends. He valued families, showing profound empathy for their needs and problems, and he freely showed his affection for children.—Read Mark 10:13-16.

 

Quote

Our work nourishes us spiritually and brings us delight as well. Yet, we never want to be extremists, displaying a self-righteous or ascetic spirit. Like Jesus, we want to be joyful, balanced servants of “the happy God.”—1 Tim. 1:11.

 

 

This update really emphasised to consider all costs, including how to wisely keep one’s family more focused on the kingdom, while ultimately less time slaving for this system. How that is achieved is not based on the unknowing opinions or perceptions of others, but on family heads and wisely applying bible principles. 

[SteveAus]

I just roll with it. If it's Jehovah's will, so be it. If it was a mistake made by fallible men, I still roll with it, as the final outcome is the same, despite any bumps in the road to our final destination.

[Amygdala]

When I think back to when I was finishing school in Canada, it was vogue for some in the congregations not to even finish highschool, do home study and even drop out without even finishing graduation to start full-time pioneering. Almost like a race to see who could get out of school first.

 

Personally I never thought that was ok, even though I had no parents in the truth. So I can see why those who wanted to continue their studies were judged or looked down upon harshly back then felt so.

I also knew others who went to uni and pioneered while living with their parents. But back in the 90’s people could get relatively good paying jobs without the need for a certificate or degree. I was such a case. Finishing highschool and with help from sisters and Jehovah , got a job directly working part-time at a credit union. All of my licensing over the years, mutual funds, mortgage advising, banking and analytical systems, sales and computer skills training were covered by my work. I was able to regular pioneer during that time.

 

I know some who were motivated to start successful business right out of highschool without the need of further education, either.But today we live in vastly different times.

So looking back I understand why there was the pressure not to go beyond the basic schooling. For one sister I knew who did drop out, even leaving the truth to waitress, shaved her head, got her nose and tongue pierced and lived in the world. Later came back to the truth, got her GDP, got training as a legal assistant, regular pioneered and served in foreign language and is today happily serving in full-time service with her husband.

[Ishaya]

I am very happy with this update, this is what truly reflects the principle at 2 Corinthians 1:24

 

"Not that we are the masters over your faith,but we are fellow workers for your joy, for it is by your faith that you are standing."

 

I just want to be able to serve Jehovah because of my faith and love for him and not because someone is coercing me to do what they say.

 

I left Christendom where the clergy use every manner of restraints to coerce people to do what they say,alot of people fear them and just do their bidding without asking questions.

 

Im so happy that Jehovah's organization is a different place altogether.

[Julsey]

On 8/22/2025 at 11:32 PM, MM9106 said:

“Eternal Happiness” is an incredible theme for a convention. Very excited to see which countries and cities will have international conventions. 

When can we start the 2026 convention spoiler thread? 😉

[Shawnster]

13 hours ago, Bob said:

I am somewhat uncomfortable with many brothers saying this update is nothing and nothing has changed from before. 

 

This is a change. Brother Splaine even said it was a change. 

 

At the beginning of the broadcast, at the 4:05 timestamp brother Splaine said; "Is it appropriate for Christians to pursue additional education?  With this update, we’d like to clarify our understanding: While there are dangers involved in pursuing certain forms of education, basically, whether to obtain additional education or not is a matter for personal decision."

 

The Governing Body has clarified our understanding in regards Christians choosing to pursue additional education. 

 

Our understanding is clarified.  In other words, our understanding has changed. Clarifications are nothing new to Jehovah's people. We continually clarify our beliefs. When those beliefs are clarified we rejoice because our thinking becomes even closer aligned with Jehovah's. We change our point of view on a belief or teaching. We abandon that old thinking in favor of the new understanding. We make a change. 

 

Our understanding on additional education has changed. We have had other adjustments and changes in these past few years such as beards, dress and grooming, and toasting. 

 

But we have made a change. The fact the Governing Body saw fit to have this update focused on this clarification indicates we have made a change. 

 

Brother Splaine said our understanding is clarified. When we have a belief clarified, we understand somethings has changed. The terminology is the same whether it's a belief or understanding. In this context, clarification is change. 

[dljbsp]

17 minutes ago, Shawnster said:

This is a change

Respectfully, I do not feel the same.
 

You could think of it this way:

• A change would mean what was taught before was false and is now replaced.
• A clarification means the earlier understanding was incomplete, but now Jehovah’s spirit has helped refine it to be more accurate or specific.

The word clarify comes from the Latin clarus (“clear, bright”). In Middle English, “to clarify” often meant to make clear by melting or refining, especially in cooking (like clarifying butter) or in smelting metals — removing impurities until only the pure, bright material remained.

 

So when the GB speak of clarification of understanding, the word fits well: it’s not scrapping truth and starting over, but refining it — like smelting ore to remove slag until only the pure metal remain

It is now clear what should be considered, and who make those decision, and that the rest do not Judge.

Edited 10 hours ago by dljbsp

[Shawnster]

1 hour ago, dljbsp said:

So when the GB speak of clarification of understanding, the word fits well: it’s not scrapping truth and starting over

 

I don't see anyone suggesting this. 

 

You and I are likely using different words to say the same thing 

[Robinson]

1 hour ago, dljbsp said:

1 hour ago, Shawnster said:

This is a change

Respectfully, I do not feel the same.

I feel the organization hasn't changed it's view on additional education. But its view of those who pursue additional education and how others should view them has changed.

 

Therefore, I don't see the update as a change. Instead, I see it as clarification that will lead to change.

Edited 9 hours ago by Robinson

[blanchard]

8 minutes ago, Shawnster said:

You and I are likely using different words to say the same thing 

Yes I agree "to say the same thing"

[trottigy]

10 hours ago, YayaMichelle said:

 

But  wouldn’t this be harder to prove now after the update? What would now be a good evidence that an elder  beyond reasonable doubt is “encouraging his family and others to focus on making more money at the cost of his spirituality”.  An eyewitness? Or  Someone reporting him that he gave that advice to someone? He could easily refute/deny that.
 

Before the update last Friday, an elder father sending his child to college is already a sufficient factual evidence across many congregations globally (NOT ALL) to make him step down as an elder. 
 

AFTER the update last Friday, it appears like sending the kid to university per se is no longer acceptable as an evidence as it has gained immunity from “judging”.

not sure if i made sense. Maybe not.  sorry.

 

 

"Hard to prove"?

 

This almost makes it sound like you're out to get someone because you want to prove that they've done something wrong. It really should never have been like that, but to me that's what this update was about.

 

It is obvious that in at least some congregations, if not many, a person attending higher education was automatically looked at as no longer being exemplary. But, it shouldn't have been that way.

 

We don't want to just prove that someone's doing something wrong, but on the other hand, we want to help someone to do what is right. We want to assist them to see whether a choice they've made is affecting their spirituality or not. If it is affecting it, we want to encourage them to make an adjustment and if it isn't affecting it, we want to encourage them in general because we love them.

 

So, questions like this are still valid to ask an elder: 

 

Does his life pattern show that he puts Kingdom interests first in his life?

Does he teach his family members to put Kingdom interests first?  

Does his speech and conduct reveal that he is a spiritual person?

Does he have theocratic goals?

Does the pursuit of higher education interfere with regular meeting attendance, meaningful participation in field service, or other theocratic activities?

 

These aren't gotcha questions. These questions show genuine concern about someone. One would hope that every elder would answer yes to those first four questions. And no to the last one. And if not, he's going to need some assistance, don't you think?

 

Just like we work hard to bring people in the truth. We work hard to keep them in the truth. This is the same with how much work we put in a brother to assist him to become appointed. We work hard to keep him that way. We need as much help as we can get encouraging the friends to stay focused on spiritual things. In other threads we've talked about how important it is to stay awake and keep on guard. If one of us loses that focus, another one of us should be able to encourage and motivate to get our focus back.

 

After all, isn't that what Jesus did to Peter when he started to sink while walking on water. Jesus is our example, we have to imitate him.

Edited 7 hours ago by trottigy