The Mysterious Coronavirus Spreading Worldwide

[Naturale]

On 7/11/2021 at 1:21 PM, Sofia said:

Still the full vaccinated are protected. a few of them got sick. If we didnt had the vaccines we were doomed.

Vaccines don’t end pandemics.

The Spanish flu epidemic, which stretched over four years, didn’t end with a vaccine. (At the time most health officials had no idea even what a virus was.) Instead, that pandemic only petered out when the virus evolved from a novel killer to just another benign flu-maker.
Pandemics end when the pathogen or its environment changes or when people successfully change their behaviours or immune systems.

Andrew Nikiforuk 
https://thetyee.ca/Analysis/2020/11/26/Putting-Vaccine-Buzz-Perspective/

 

 

https://theconversation.com/severe-covid-in-young-people-can-mostly-be-explained-by-obesity-new-study-159072

 

[trottigy]

1 hour ago, Naturale said:

Vaccines don’t end pandemics.

The Spanish flu epidemic, which stretched over four years, didn’t end with a vaccine. (At the time most health officials had no idea even what a virus was.) Instead, that pandemic only petered out when the virus evolved from a novel killer to just another benign flu-maker.
Pandemics end when the pathogen or its environment changes or when people successfully change their behaviours or immune systems.

Andrew Nikiforuk 
https://thetyee.ca/Analysis/2020/11/26/Putting-Vaccine-Buzz-Perspective/

 

 

https://theconversation.com/severe-covid-in-young-people-can-mostly-be-explained-by-obesity-new-study-159072

 

Yes, instead the Spanish Flu ended with a great many dead people (1/3 of global population with it and 10% of those dead - in today's #s that would be 2.6 billion with it and 260 million dead), but hey - they reached global herd immunity    eventually (as you noted after 4 years!! - imagine 4 years of COVID)??!!

 

I am not sure if you are suggesting the same ending - instead of vaccines - a LOT of deaths? Isn't it better to stop this with vaccines - like has been done with polio and other diseases?

 

EDIT: On the other hand - you might be on to something here. Let's think this through. If it were allowed to ravage instead of slowing and possibly stopping with vaccines and that many of the elderly, sick (those with underlying conditions), and some others died - once the dust settled (say 4 years) - there would be a lot less sick, elderly and just people in general. Perhaps that could usher in an era of "peace and security" without so much financial resources going to help the homeless (who'd mostly be dead too) and the sick and the elderly. HEY! You might be on to something here. 🤯

Edited July 12, 2021 by trottigy

[rocket]

https://www.jw.org/en/jehovahs-witnesses/faq/jw-vaccines-immunization/

 

Are Jehovah's Witnesses opposed to vaccinations?

[On the huh]

If a vaccine for the Spanish flu was developed, would it have ended sooner?  At least, fewer people would have died.

It is true that co-vid will be here for a while longer yet, but vaccines mean fewer deaths and fewer people getting seriously ill.

[On the huh]

All restrictions to be lifted in England on the 19th, Boris has confirmed.  Although cautious is still needed, and while face masks and social distance won't be legal requirements, it is still recommended in certain situations (like crowded places).

 

Restrictions on gathering for worship also lifted.  At least legally that is.  Waiting for our Head.  He is still saying no, not yet.

[trottigy]

I was just talking to a workmate. One of our superintendents was hospitalized from COVID. He is pretty sick (no, he wasn't vaccinated). He said he caught it while attending church - as several others from his church also came down with it shortly before him.

 

Well, I guess it might still be a while, eh.

[Lee49]

9 minutes ago, trottigy said:

Well, I guess it might still be a while, eh.

Looking for predictions? I hereby predict no less than one year from this date! 

[Dustparticle]

42 minutes ago, Lee49 said:

Looking for predictions? I hereby predict no less than one year from this date! 

And I will predict that I will never eat chocolate again.

[Lee49]

11 minutes ago, Dustparticle said:

And I will predict that I will never eat chocolate again.

Until ? -  

[Shawnster]

3 hours ago, Naturale said:

Vaccines don’t end pandemics.

The Spanish flu epidemic, which stretched over four years, didn’t end with a vaccine. (At the time most health officials had no idea even what a virus was.)

Well, duh.  Since there was no flu vaccine then, of course, the last pandemic could not have been ended by a vaccine.  

 

Times have changed.  Technology has marched on.  We now have a vaccine available at the same time there is a pandemic.  We'll see if a vaccine will finally end a pandemic.

 

Of course, that requires people to actually take the vaccine.

[Ludwika]

4 hours ago, Naturale said:

Vaccines don’t end pandemics.

The Spanish flu epidemic, which stretched over four years, didn’t end with a vaccine. (At the time most health officials had no idea even what a virus was.) Instead, that pandemic only petered out when the virus evolved from a novel killer to just another benign flu-maker.
Pandemics end when the pathogen or its environment changes or when people successfully change their behaviours or immune systems.

Andrew Nikiforuk 
https://thetyee.ca/Analysis/2020/11/26/Putting-Vaccine-Buzz-Perspective/

 

 

https://theconversation.com/severe-covid-in-young-people-can-mostly-be-explained-by-obesity-new-study-159072

 

So what are you saying, that those who die are just collateral damage? 

The Spanish flu killed an estimated 20 million people in less than a year according to records at the time. Probably that's an underestimated number. And people fly and move around to an unprecedented degree today compared to back then. So the death rate would be far higher given that the pathogen has a similar trajectory and infection rate. 

If you'd be happy to see that happen when it could be prevented... well! What's left to say?!

[Sofia]

3 hours ago, trottigy said:

EDIT: On the other hand - you might be on to something here. Let's think this through. If it were allowed to ravage instead of slowing and possibly stopping with vaccines and that many of the elderly, sick (those with underlying conditions), and some others died - once the dust settled (say 4 years) - there would be a lot less sick, elderly and just people in general. Perhaps that could usher in an era of "peace and security" without so much financial resources going to help the homeless (who'd mostly be dead too) and the sick and the elderly. HEY! You might be on to something here. 🤯

I believe ... MY opinion only... for all it´s worth... that this pandemic will end up in GT.

We cant predict HOW long it lasts... maybe months maybe another year or 2. But Im positive it CAN end up in GT. 

3 hours ago, rocket said:

https://www.jw.org/en/jehovahs-witnesses/faq/jw-vaccines-immunization/

 

Are Jehovah's Witnesses opposed to vaccinations?

Food at proper time !!

 

[Sofia]

3 hours ago, trottigy said:

I was just talking to a workmate. One of our superintendents was hospitalized from COVID. He is pretty sick (no, he wasn't vaccinated). He said he caught it while attending church - as several others from his church also came down with it shortly before him.

 

Well, I guess it might still be a while, eh.

3 hours ago, trottigy said:

Well, I guess it might still be a while, eh.

yes! it s not over yet

2 hours ago, Dustparticle said:

And I will predict that I will never eat chocolate again.

never say that again brother Glen!

1 hour ago, Shawnster said:

Of course, that requires people to actually take the vaccine.

that s the issue!

[rocket]

Looking at stats like 95%-100% of Covid Cases/hospitalizations/deaths are among the unvaccinated,  I'll take my chances with the vaccine. Vaccines may not end the pandemic in itself but like masks and social distancing, it is a tool that's working to mitigate it and give people hope that some day it will go away.

 

https://www.bing.com/news/search?q=95%+Of+New+COVID+Cases+Are+Among+The+Unvaccinated&qpvt=95%+of+new+covid+cases+are+among+the+unvaccinated&FORM=EWRE

 

In Wisconsin, 95% of COVID-19 deaths since March were among unvaccinated

 

Orange officials: Unvaccinated make up 95% of recent COVID deaths

Maryland Says 100% Of June Covid Deaths Were Among The Unvaccinated, As Early Data Shows Similar Trend Nationally

 

100% of June COVID deaths in Maryland were among unvaccinated people, data shows

 

Coronavirus cases among the unvaccinated are on the rise in Georgia

 

Nearly all new Minnesota COVID cases, hospitalizations and deaths were among the unvaccinated

 

Utah: if you're unvaccinated, it's a matter of when — not if — you'll get the delta variant

 

Majority of new COVID-19 deaths, hospitalizations, cases are among unvaccinated, Wyoming data shows

 

Nearly all COVID deaths in US are now among unvaccinated

 

[hatcheckgirl]

8 hours ago, Naturale said:

Vaccines don’t end pandemics.

The Spanish flu epidemic, which stretched over four years, didn’t end with a vaccine. (At the time most health officials had no idea even what a virus was.) Instead, that pandemic only petered out when the virus evolved from a novel killer to just another benign flu-maker.
Pandemics end when the pathogen or its environment changes or when people successfully change their behaviours or immune systems.

Andrew Nikiforuk 
https://thetyee.ca/Analysis/2020/11/26/Putting-Vaccine-Buzz-Perspective/

 

 

https://theconversation.com/severe-covid-in-young-people-can-mostly-be-explained-by-obesity-new-study-159072

 

It’s actually a very interesting article, written back in November 2020, so it offers food for thought in hindsight.

 

Firstly, as you quoted, at the time of the Spanish Flu, there was no concept of viruses, hence no vaccines that could be used to curb the pandemic (along with social distancing, masks etc).

 

But reading on, it mentions the reason why vaccines may not work effectively as they are designed to, and that’s all down to human mistakes and perceptions.

 

For instance, the Ebola epidemic, more deadlier than covid, had resistance to the vaccination program. “Despite a highly-effective, one-shot vaccine, it took more than two years to bring that outbreak under control due to community distrust and widespread political violence.”

Other factors that show human expectations are misplaced if they think the pandemic is over just because we are vaccinated. That simply will not happen straight away. We need to be aware that it will be a while before everyone is vaccinated to the level needed for herd immunity. “That means people who receive the vaccine could still pass on infection to others. That suggests that the vaccinated will still have to practice social distancing and mask wearing. It also guarantees that the pandemic will not end quickly.” So, rather than vaccines not working to end the pandemic, it’s our own thinking that needs to change, our expectation.

 

Lastly, the article said that even with the vaccination rollout, it’s going to take time to get everyone done, thereby prolonging the pandemic even further. The most vulnerable are vaccinated first, but who are really spreading it? The under 40s, and they are last on the rollout of vaccination timeframe.

 

And now with the delta strain, I think a lot of people are reevaluating their vaccine choices.  It’s a race to get the vaccination done to get ahead of this very transmissible variant. Vaccine hesitancy based on scare-mongering misinformation had fomented complacency here in Australia. With the delta variant raging in Sydney, and little if any covid community cases so no herd immunity means all of Australia is vulnerable (unlike the rest of the world which has some community immunity). 
 

This pandemic will not end just because there are vaccines, but the benefits of a mass vaccination program are definitely lowered by humans and their inability to manage anything for their fellow humans. It is Satan’s world after all.

 

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-07-13/who-tedros-covid-19-boosters-vaccine-inequality/100287792
(The world can’t even share the vaccines with poorer nations, so how is this pandemic supposed to end? It’s due to human greed, human failings)

[rocket]

Pockets of Unvaccinated Americans Threaten to Prolong Pandemic

 

Quote

 

As much of the country emerges from masking and social distancing, under vaccinated pockets in the U.S. still threaten to bring the virus roaring back...

 

Less than 25% of the population is fully vaccinated in at least 482 counties, according to an analysis of Centers for Disease Control and Prevention data...

 

 

[On the huh]

At the vaccination centre I attended, and many others across the country, there is a information poster, a graphic of a 4 piece jigsaw with the heading "Vaccines are just part of the solution".  It highlights that other measures still need to be taken.  Whether people take heed is another matter.  But the overall majority of people do see the vaccine as the total solution, and act accordingly.

 

I do worry, and maybe it is an unwarranted worry, that the longer the virus is around, it has a chance to mutate and develop immunity to the current vaccines, and we will be back to square one again.   And the new found "freedoms" of the vaccinated will be short lived.

[Sofia]

9 hours ago, rocket said:

Vaccines may not end the pandemic in itself but like masks and social distancing, it is a tool that's working to mitigate it and give people hope that some day it will go away.

Exactly 

wiser to be vaccinated than to catch the natural infection 

 

but of course it’s a personal choice

[Sofia]

2 hours ago, On the huh said:

do worry, and maybe it is an unwarranted worry, that the longer the virus is around, it has a chance to mutate and develop immunity to the current vaccines, and we will be back to square one again

Coronavirus don’t work that way fortunately 

chances are even that natural infection can give you immunity for life

dont fear that 

this is based upon the first sars cov 1 virus behavior 

after 18 years the ones who got it are still imune

Edited July 13, 2021 by Sofia

[Dustparticle]

In California and some other places cameras are being set up in KH's so it can be hook up for those who do not want or cannot come back to the KH's. It is going to be this way.

Edited July 13, 2021 by Dustparticle

[Sofia]

5 minutes ago, Dustparticle said:

In California and some other places cameras are being set up in KH's so it can be hook up for those who do not want or cannot come back to the KH's. It is going to be this way.

I understand: inside cameras to transmit to whoever atends at home. Makes sense 

Edited July 13, 2021 by Sofia

[Sofia]

11 hours ago, hatcheckgirl said:

(The world can’t even share the vaccines with poorer nations, so how is this pandemic supposed to end? It’s due to human greed, human failings)

yep - human failing. Many countries with surplus vaccines, poorer ones with so few. Badly organized...

 

UNICEF is in charge of letting vaccines arrive to all parts of the World. A Global Ceasefire was demanded by UN chief to allow humanitary services including vaccines, but is being done is such a slow motion... leading this pandemic to last longer than many expected... giving us time before the GT to gather the last sheep by teaching them before its too late. If this pandemic is still on... it must be a reson behind it.

We all must keep safe meanwhile by all means possible.

[AH173]

24 minutes ago, Dustparticle said:

In California and some other places cameras are being set up in KH's so it can be hook up for those who do not want or cannot come back to the KH's. It is going to be this way.

At my double hall, we were doing this before the 2020 pandemic. 

[Dustparticle]

Here is the latest in USA https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/13/health/us-coronavirus-tuesday/index.html

[Dustparticle]

8 hours ago, Sofia said:

I understand: inside cameras to transmit to whoever atends at home. Makes sense 

What make more sense is that if I want stay home and overload on chocolate, I just stay home and listen to the meeting on zoom.