Covid-19 Vaccine Research, Development, Ingredients and Reactions

[SUNRAY]

Just a thought..I do not own a gun..does that mean I am part of a "gun control political movement"?  I choose to not eat  GMO food ..does that mean I am part of a political movement of ones protesting against the use of GMO seeds? I may choose to not take a vaccine..Does that make me part of the "Antivaxer" movement? You may choose to take a vaccine..does that make you part of a pro-vaccine group? Something to think about..we here are true Christians, and I would never accuse anyone with honesty and with good motive of being otherwise.

[Tortuga]

15 minutes ago, SUNRAY said:

A simple statement: "I found  this information interesting, and would like to share" and a link, might be a way for ones posting to not come across in an offensive way.

That's a wonderful idea. All of us want to be peacemakers and peacekeepers but it seems that this topic has become divisive. It would be nice if everyone participating in this topic only posted references without posting their opinions. Would that still give you the information that you need?

[Tortuga]

3 minutes ago, SUNRAY said:

Something to think about..we here are true Christians, and I would never accuse anyone with honesty and with good motive of being otherwise.

Absolutely and I apologise if anything that I said suggested otherwise. The purpose of this site is to provide a haven from worldly attitudes, protests, rebellions. We want to be able to freely build up and encourage our brothers and sisters without any taint of a worldly attitude. We appreciate all of the members showing love, kindness and humility when they share useful information with each other. It is truly refreshing.

[SUNRAY]

3 minutes ago, Tortuga said:

That's a wonderful idea. All of us want to be peacemakers and peacekeepers but it seems that this topic has become divisive. It would be nice if everyone participating in this topic only posted references without posting their opinions. Would that still give you the information that you need?

Absolutely Richard..also, this thread is not titled: "Should I take a vaccine or not..what do you think?" It is about ingredients.

[Tortuga]

2 minutes ago, SUNRAY said:

Absolutely Richard..also, this thread is not titled: "Should I take a vaccine or not..what do you think?" It is about ingredients.

Thanks for the reminder. The Moderators will be more diligent about removing the off-topic comments.👍

[SUNRAY]

4 minutes ago, Tortuga said:

Thanks for the reminder. The Moderators will be more diligent about removing the off-topic comments.👍

I also appreciate knowing of any adverse reactions to ingredients. 

[hatcheckgirl]

On 2/4/2021 at 8:35 PM, Naturale said:

The fact is that the very first vaccines for COVID-19  are an entirely new type: mRNA vaccines. Never before have mRNA vaccines — such as the two-dose Pfizer/BioNTech and Moderna vaccines that have now received emergency use authorization from the FDA — been approved for use in any disease.   Therefore no-one can know yet what reactions people will have in the long term as a substantial amount of time would likely have to pass to see what happens.  

 

6 hours ago, Naturale said:

Novel mRNA vaccines have no precedence of regulatory approval.  Moreover, the MHRA does not have an established bank of historical data on their possible long term adverse and unintended effects.  

I googled mRNA having no precedence of regulatory approval. 
 

mRNA Vaccines Are New, But Not Unknown

Researchers have been studying and working with mRNA vaccines for decades. Interest has grown in these vaccines because they can be developed in a laboratory using readily available materials. This means the process can be standardized and scaled up, making vaccine development faster than traditional methods of making vaccines.

mRNA vaccines have been studied before for flu, Zika, rabies, and cytomegalovirus (CMV). As soon as the necessary information about the virus that causes COVID-19 was available, scientists began designing the mRNA instructions for cells to build the unique spike protein into an mRNA vaccine.

 

Future mRNA vaccine technology may allow for one vaccine to provide protection for multiple diseases, thus decreasing the number of shots needed for protection against common vaccine-preventable diseases.

 

Beyond vaccines, cancer research has used mRNA to trigger the immune system to target specific cancer cells.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/mrna.html

 

The point you make about long term effects is true. It is a risk. It behooves us all to make informed choices. But all treatments in this s system carry side effects. I feel that a lot of misinformation out there is more due to political agendas either against big pharma or against authorities. Which is why we try to quote reputable sites, not fringe ones that support our personal flavour of the bigger debate on whether to vaccinate or not. 
 

Because there is a fine line between information on the covid vaccine (which we all are here for) and using information to support your stance on vaccination. It becomes a scare campaign instead of information. 
 

There is so far more good being done with vaccinations than bad. But you even dispute that, from the very beginning of your posts here, even saying the FDS have not commented on vaccines for decades. You’ve brought in the ethics of testing on animals for vaccine production. Even the statement about polio was spun with quotes about side effects of OPV, which we’ve discussed in another thread. The point being that by far, with little exception, vaccines have helped rid the world of hideous diseases. 
 

All this to me muddies the waters on clear and specific information about covid vaccines, for which this thread was inititially started. It is not meant for pro or against vaccination. And I think that line’s been crossed. 
 

As this persists, it makes it difficult for us participating her to get value from comments posted. It’s not meant to be a debate about vaccines and is therefore causing divisions. All of us need information to make our personal decision. 
 

I apologise in advance if I too have crossed that line. It’s not worth me putting down my comments if I offend you. You are more precious to me as my sister than our personal differences.  And I too am wary of taking vaccines because I see your point about time will tell about long term effects. But that’s up to us to take that risk if we choose. For the good vaccination in general has done, that might be the best option for some, until the new system is here. 

[Lance]

We do have an alternative  choice discussion where we can post our personal views on Covid treatment..  

 

In the future we will be moving polarized views to their respective topic.. we are getting a little tired of the “ya but” I have this article from so and so, which  will blow your opinion out of the water...  we all should understand that what ever treatment you take or don’t take is with “your”God given conscience. You may say but “ I have to inform their conscience” ...

Stop .. 

That is not the way an informed personal conscience works ..

We have divided the topics so if you feel so inclined to want to say something possibly polarizing go to your respective topic and let it fly.. in a respectful way.😇❤️

 

 

 

Edited February 5, 2021 by trottigy

[BLEmom]

9 minutes ago, hatcheckgirl said:

I feel that a lot of misinformation out there is more due to political agendas either against big pharma or against authorities. Which is why we try to quote reputable sites, not fringe ones that support our personal flavour of the bigger debate on whether to vaccinate or not. 

Dipping one toe in....lol.  What I see is that information is part of the problem. Who decides what is true?  If you only trust mainstream medicine or you only trust alternative medicine, you tend to be swayed one way or the other. There is value in both but most people tend to go all one way or the other. Can we trust all alternative medical advice?  No.  Can we trust all mainstream medical advice?  Again no. 
It’s a tricky business on what links are allowed to be posted. If you only allow one side, say pro vaccine which is mainstream, you are taking a stand that no one is allowed to discuss their reasons for not taking them. But I also understand that some other info that is more anti vaccine can seem to be really out there. 
I agree with Sunray in that both sides should be allowed to present the info they find. 
it’s a personal responsibility. we all have to look at the info and decide if we want to take it into account in our household. What tends to happen instead is that someone posts info and then there are responses telling the person why that research is wrong or faulty. That’s where the arguing starts. If you don’t agree with info in someone’s link, don’t agree. But why try to convince that person they are wrong for believing or reading the medical advice they want?

As an example, cancer treatment. Most people go mainstream with chemo and radiation.  They think those that go off to clinics in Mexico for treatment are crazy. The opposite is also true. Should we try to convince someone headed to a Mexican clinic that their research is wrong and they should only do chemo?  No, that would be just as wrong as telling the person doing chemo, they are poisoning their body and recommending 50 different herbs to take instead. 
so my opinion is this, everyone should stop trying to tell everyone else they are wrong for their choices on the vaccines. Share the info, share the links but don’t argue over the info.  If it bothers you to read about some who don’t take vaccines, guess what?  You don’t have to read about it. Avoid the thread. If you don’t like that people take the vaccines, the same would apply. 
I think even a combo of info would be good. Some people choose to take vaccines and then follow a form of detox protocol afterwards. Funny how that compromise in thought never gets discussed, it’s just one way or the other. 
we all need to calm down.  Learn and read things and then make your personal decision. 
Now backing slowly away. 🤪
 

[Tortuga]

20 minutes ago, BLEmom said:

It’s a tricky business on what links are allowed to be posted. If you only allow one side, say pro vaccine which is mainstream, you are taking a stand that no one is allowed to discuss their reasons for not taking them. But I also understand that some other info that is more anti vaccine can seem to be really out there. 
I agree with Sunray in that both sides should be allowed to present the info they find. 

That is a challenge for the Moderators, we want to maintain an up building site but still allow everyone freeness of speech. We draw the line when we see someone is not a peacemaker. Many times the Moderators will receive private comments or Reports about an individual and we have to consider the collective opinion of the members. We appreciate it when everyone parks their egos at the door and shows love and kindness.

 

BTW: Thank you very much for the feedback 👍

Edited February 5, 2021 by Tortuga

[Loopy]

1 hour ago, SUNRAY said:

Just a thought..I do not own a gun..does that mean I am part of a "gun control political movement"?  I choose to not eat  GMO food ..does that mean I am part of a political movement of ones protesting against the use of GMO seeds? I may choose to not take a vaccine..Does that make me part of the "Antivaxer" movement? You may choose to take a vaccine..does that make you part of a pro-vaccine group? Something to think about..we here are true Christians, and I would never accuse anyone with honesty and with good motive of being otherwise.

Sunray, I agree with you. ☺️ 
 

The way I look at things like this is whether anyone is for/against, whatever, like this vaccine business, we all have free will to decide the direction we personally are going to go. Right or wrong it’s an individual decision. That individual has the “free will” to make that decision. 
 

We know that if there’s nothing morally or scripturally wrong with something, it’s still a personal decision. If someone doesn’t want to take the vaccine for whatever reason.....so be it. If they decide to take it for whatever reason...so be it. 
 

We should just let it go.
 

This all stems from a reaction I got about from a sister this morning when I mentioned about trying the blood 🩸 type diet. 💥  

 

And others who because I don’t do something the way they do it, or wasn’t taught the way they were,  I’m wrong and often reminded. 
 

So again, we should just agree to disagree I guess would be the way to put it. 
 

Okay, I’ll climb down from my soapbox ☺️

 

[trottigy]

And that’s the line the moderators do their best to keep things from crossing - where expressing an opinion is ok (as long as it’s stated as an opinion and not a fact), but trying to push one’s belief on others regardless is not. This is especially a line crossed when the so-called “evidence” used to push a particular belief is based on mis-applied or partiality quoted “proof”.

 

Edited February 5, 2021 by trottigy

[Lance]

From New Scientist magazine.. 

https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg24933174-000-you-can-boost-a-vaccines-effect-with-good-moods-and-good-friends/

You can boost a vaccine’s effect with good moods and good friends...

AS COVID-19 vaccine roll-out begins in earnest in many countries, there is an extra reason to be cheerful. Such an outlook, along with other personality traits and the kinds of social interactions we have, can enhance how our bodies react to immunisations.

“There is now a large literature that shows that these sorts of psychological factors influence how people respond to vaccinations as measured by magnitude of antibody response,” says Anna Marsland, a psychologist at the University of Pittsburgh in Pennsylvania.

In one of the first studies of its kind, in 2006, Marsland and her colleagues found that people who described themselves as energetic, cheerful or relaxed produced a 73 per cent greater antibody response to vaccination against the virally transmitted disease hepatitis B than those who regarded themselves as more nervous, tense or angry.

Since then, numerous studies have expanded our understanding of the impact these so-called soft drivers of immunity can have.

Other research, for instance, has found that even your mood on the day of an immunisation can make a difference. Among 138 older people, those who were in a positive state of mind on the day of a flu shot were better protected by the vaccine 16 weeks later than those who were in a less upbeat mood. The study examined other factors that might have an influence, such as sleep and physical activity in the run-up to the vaccination, but none of these had a significant effect.

Similarly, optimism can act as a vaccine boost, while neuroticism is linked to a poorer antibody response to immunisation.

Social connections can also influence how well our body responds to a vaccine. In one experiment, 83 students receiving a flu shot were asked to name up to 20 people they knew well and with whom they were in contact at least once a month. At check-ups one month and then four months later, those who had listed fewer than 13 friends produced significantly fewer antibodies to the influenza virus.

 

Edited February 6, 2021 by Lance

[SUNRAY]

21 minutes ago, trottigy said:

And that’s the line the moderators do their best to keep things from crossing - where expressing an opinion is ok (as long as it’s stated as an opinion and not a fact), but trying to push one’s belief on others regardless is not. This is especially a line crossed when the so-called “evidence” used to push a particular belief is based on mis-applied or partiality quoted “proof”.

 

If ones would stick to the topic "Vaccine Ingredients" there would not be any posts on this thread regarding whether or not to take a vaccine! Any and all posts regarding ingredients in each vaccine have been factual, right from the manufacurers' website. When I learned about PEG (from antifreeze) being part of the nano-particle lipid encasing the RNA or DNA antigen, I remembered reading before about PEG being an ingredient (stablizer) in fragranced body products..perfume, body lotion, etc. I am allergic to most fragrances with chemical additives..so that got my attention..I read that most likely my immune system already has a good supply of antibodies to PEG, so when it is introduced by injection along with other lipid ingredients that are irritants (to cause inflamation in your arm on purpose...to mount a stong immune defense), it is as though the immune system says: "Wait a minute..what is this! I will really attack you this time!"..thus an over reaction..with potentially very serious results for those with CFS. If anything injected along, with an aduvent .. not alum, but now fat (lipids) such as squalene or oil from the Soap Bark tree which have both sustained excellent immune responses, the body's immune system tags that ingredient as an enemy..Our own body makes squalene to coat our nerve sheaths on nerves and in the brain. If our immune system tags it because of being injected, and tries to remove it, the body has to make more squalene to coat the nerves! There are serious diseases that can result from this scenario. So..ingredients matter! Spike protein? not the issue..it is other ingredients. Thus I am examining these.

[SUNRAY]

16 minutes ago, Lance said:

The study examined other factors that might have an influence, such as sleep and physical activity in the run-up to the vaccination, but none of these had a significant effect.

I am glad to hear this, because I lack in both areas!! 

[Qapla]

Just as a point of interest ... edit by mod ..( title has been changed to reflect the direction  of posts.. John is not loooooooooosing  it. Yet ...😎... good post though..👍)

 

The title of the thread is "Covid-19 Vaccine Discussion"

 

It does not include the words:

• Ingredients
• Effects
• Administration
• Pro
• Con
• Timing
• Testing
• Approval
• Evidence
• News

Therefore, we cannot say it is "about" any particular aspect of Covid-19 vaccine(s) ... it would seem to cover any/all of these things.  However, just like at the meeting, it does say "discussion" ... not talk/narrative/rant/exposé or any other form of "proving my point".

 

It does good to remember that this particular virus is NEW. All data on this virus is NEW. All treatments for this virus are NEW. No one knows any of the long-term effects of the virus, treatment(s), vaccines or or lack of such.

 

Just some food for thought - I bake bread. I can measure all the ingredients by volume or percentage for a "consistent" loaf and get different results every time. It's true. There are so many factors that come into play with bread baking that no one can say for 100% that a particular mixture of ingredients on one day will have the exact same results on another day. The weather, humidity, barometric pressure, time or effort spent kneading (plus a few other things) all have an impact on the final result.

 

The same holds true of viruses and the treatments for them. Not everyone will react the same. While some people get a mild case, other die. While some treatments work for some, others have an adverse reaction to them.

 

Just like with a loaf of bread - no two people respond exactly the same. We can get predictable results most of the time - but nothing can be guaranteed nor work for everyone, every time.

 

Before we extol or condemn any particular treatment, we should consider that others may not have the same reactions as us - not to the virus nor to the "data". Let's try not to insist that we each have the "one recipe" that all should use. Let's try not to sound as though, "If you only knew what I know" or "If you would only listen to me" you would see it my way.

 

Think about it. The FDS has informed us that more than 8,600 of our brothers and sisters have died from this virus. They have let us know which vaccines do not contain blood. They have given us direction to be safe - wear a mask, physical distancing, limit exposure, frequent hand washing. They have remined us that medical decisions are a personal decision. What they have not even mention is if they are taking any of the vaccines or what, if any, medical opinion they may have. Perhaps we could follow suit?

 

 

Edited February 6, 2021 by Lance

[Amygdala]

18 minutes ago, SUNRAY said:

I read that most likely my immune system already has a good supply of antibodies to PEG

For some with raised or elevated PEG levels is a danger, and can cause severe anaphylactic reactions. They are advised against taking the vaccine.

 

More interesting info about it I found here:
 

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/12/suspicions-grow-nanoparticles-pfizer-s-covid-19-vaccine-trigger-rare-allergic-reactions

 

Quote

Others note the amount of PEG in the mRNA vaccines is orders of magnitude lower than in most PEGylated drugs. And whereas those drugs are often given intravenously, the two COVID-19 vaccines are injected into a muscle, which leads to a delayed exposure and a much lower level of PEG in the blood, where most anti-PEG antibodies are.

 

Quote

If PEG does turn out to be the culprit, the question is, what can be done? Screening millions of people for anti-PEG antibodies before they are vaccinated is not feasible. Instead, CDC guidelines recommend not giving the Pfizer or Moderna vaccines to anyone with a history of severe allergic reaction to any component of the vaccine.

 

[SUNRAY]

On 5/18/2020 at 10:37 AM, SUNRAY said:

There is news of Vaccines now in trial phases! It might be of interest to other friends, besides me, to benefit from your friends' research as to how the RNA vaccines are developed, what raw materials are used..what other ingredients might be used. For instance, we know how eggs have been used as a medium, or insects. Please share your research, questions here! Thanks!

When I started this vaccine discussion, my first post said why..to benefit from other's research on the developement and what ingredients are in the vaccines..not just an open ended discussion..sorry if I was not clear..

Edited February 5, 2021 by SUNRAY
spelling

[Tortuga]

1 minute ago, SUNRAY said:

When I started this vaccine discussion, my first post said why..to benefit from other's research on the develooement and what ingredients are in the vaccines..not just an open ended discussion..sorry if I was not clear..

We can revise the title if you want...

[SUNRAY]

1 minute ago, Tortuga said:

We can revise the title if you want...

Sure..how about Covid 19 vaccines..developement and ingredients.

[Tortuga]

5 minutes ago, SUNRAY said:

Sure..how about Covid 19 vaccines..developement and ingredients.

I added a little more, is that okay?

😁

[Qapla]

Now that you changed the title ... maybe you can edit my post #1116 - since you just invalidated

[SUNRAY]

29 minutes ago, Tortuga said:

I added a little more, is that okay?

😁

Fine! Thanks!

[Tortuga]

Mod Note: From this post forward the Moderators will be more diligent in hiding or moving off-topic comments. Please see the title and the initial post for the focus of this topic.

[SUNRAY]

I found this timeline concerning vaccine reactions of interest..

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/oklahoman.com/article/5677745/are-there-side-effects-to-a-covid-19-vaccine-what-are-the-ingredients-the-cost-answers-to-your-vaccine-questions/amp

 

If someone is going to have a bad reaction to a vaccine, it is likely to occur in the first six weeks after vaccination, according to medical experts. But experts still don’t know the long-term effects of the vaccines and won’t know until after the trials are completed and researchers monitor participants in the real world for years after.