Russia invades Ukraine

[Korotkiy]

Probably Russians destroyed the dam because this remained the only way where Ukrainian troops might cross the Dnipro with tanks and heavy weapons during expected counteroffence.

But anyway this is wild act of terror. Maybe one of biggest technogenic catastrophe in Europe during the last 50 years.

In general Russian tactic is scorched earth: when they retreating, destroy all infrastructure - exploding power plants, water stations, plundering hospitals and facilities.

One brother, friend evaquated from Berislav near Kherson told that now, when his sity is released, he have no sense to go back despite he have a house there. "Normal life never back here, everything is destroyed and plundered."

[Sofia]

3 hours ago, Korotkiy said:

Probably Russians destroyed the dam because this remained the only way where Ukrainian troops might cross the Dnipro with tanks and heavy weapons during expected counteroffence.

But anyway this is wild act of terror. Maybe one of biggest technogenic catastrophe in Europe during the last 50 years.

In general Russian tactic is scorched earth: when they retreating, destroy all infrastructure - exploding power plants, water stations, plundering hospitals and facilities.

One brother, friend evaquated from Berislav near Kherson told that now, when his sity is released, he have no sense to go back despite he have a house there. "Normal life never back here, everything is destroyed and plundered."

But Crimean citizens wont have water!

Is Russia giving up on Crimea?

 

your explanation makes sense

 

prayers for your safety 🙏😘

[carlos]

Russian and Ukrainian governments are blaming each other for the destruction. Probably we will never know the truth.

[Osprey]

10 minutes ago, carlos said:

Russian and Ukrainian governments are blaming each other for the destruction. Probably we will never know the truth.

 

Exactly, it is hard to stay neutral when such dramatic events happen, but we have to be nonetheless. Reality is that you cannot trust anyone. There is a heavy propaganda from all sides. It will be even harder in the future for sure...

Edited June 6, 2023 by Osprey

[Dustparticle]

3 hours ago, Sofia said:

This horrendous act will destroy many households lives and system suplies

it will cut out water supply from Crimea… I wonder why this has happened? Crimea is under Russian control. 
I guess war is NOT MY BUSINESS to understand 

 

its evil. period.

 

may Jehovah protects all our dearest brothers and sisters 

You are all constantly in our prayers 🙏😘❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️

I know what you mean sis. No matter what, I hope everyone will be safe. Jehovah loves everyone. Matthew 5:45.

[carlos]

I was finding it hard to stay neutral in my heart on this conflict. After all, one side was clearly acting as a bully and invading its neighbor. They were raping, killing and torturing civilians. The other side  was just defending itself.

 

Something that helped me was a comment I heard in one of the last GB reports. An Ukrainian brother who had to flee the country said they were trembling every time they met a military checkpoint, whether the soldiers were Russian or Ukrainian, since they both used to commit the same atrocities. That helped me understand that, while it's true that one side started the war, actually both are just tools in Satan's hands.

[Korotkiy]

I know this brother about 30 years (he is from a near congregation) and know his situation. His wife during interwiew clearly told that they has been afraid that solders on blocks are sometimes are not adequate, sometimes drunked, but didn`t mentioned about any atrocities, sorry.

 

[Korotkiy]

Regarding to the Russian propaganda message that there was Ukrainian forces:

1. Dam cannot be destroyed from outside by any missigle expect nuclear. Only inside power plant explosion can cause such a destruction.

2. Frankly speaking there are no reasons for Ukraine to destroy territory, making long-term ecological catasrope on its territory.

3. A week before this Russian goverment passed a law that banned any kriminal investigations regarding technogenic accidents on occupied territory.
 

 abstracting from both sides, just clarifing some objective information.

Edited June 6, 2023 by Korotkiy

[Osprey]

When hearing about such events we should try really hard not to develop any negative feelings towards one side, or even start to hate it. That would mean losing neutrality.

I remember often an example that was given in one talk (unfortunately I don't remember if it was on Broadcasting or public talk in KH or even in Watchtower article). Scenario was that we may be living in a country that suppresses JWs. Then some other party may try to win on elections and promise to obey human rights including ending persecution of JWs. Even in such case we should do everything possible to remain neutral even in our hearts. So we have to control our minds too. For sure this would be very hard but Jehovah expects this from us. We are not part of this world. There is no scenario where that would not hold.

I imagine it must be very hard for all affected brothers to remain neutral even in hearts. I pray for them every day that Jehovah helps them remain neutral and help them maintain peace and faith. 

Brothers and sisters from Ukraine, we all love you very much! You are loved and valued and soon you will live in peace like every other human on earth!

[Doug]

1 hour ago, Korotkiy said:

 

3. A week before this Russian goverment passed a law that banned any kriminal investigations regarding technogenic accidents on occupied territory.
 

 

Utter nonsense.   If it can't be investigated maybe it wasn't an accident?   Maybe?

[carlos]

4 hours ago, Korotkiy said:

abstracting from both sides, just clarifing some objective information.

 

Thanks, Yura! You, friends from Ukraine and Russia, are an example of loyalty and neutrality for all of us worldwide. We keep praying for you every day.

 

I was just pointing that we hear a lot of propaganda from all sides and often it's difficult to tell which information is reliable. As someone wrote, the first casualty of war is the truth. We are just praying that this disaster doesn't mean a lot more hardship to our brothers and sisters in the area.

[Sofia]

7 hours ago, Korotkiy said:

Regarding to the Russian propaganda message that there was Ukrainian forces:

1. Dam cannot be destroyed from outside by any missigle expect nuclear. Only inside power plant explosion can cause such a destruction.

2. Frankly speaking there are no reasons for Ukraine to destroy territory, making long-term ecological catasrope on its territory.

3. A week before this Russian goverment passed a law that banned any kriminal investigations regarding technogenic accidents on occupied territory.
 

 abstracting from both sides, just clarifing some objective information.

Who remembers this from october last year? https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/is-kakhovka-dam-ukraine-about-be-blown-2022-10-21/

 

Its being said now that the explosion was done by explosives, not missiles. And the dam was damaged in a way that it DOESNT HURT the water suply to Crimea. Coincidence?

Im glad that Crimea will still have water suply, but so many victims...  animals too  

 

[Sofia]

12 hours ago, Korotkiy said:

Probably Russians destroyed the dam because this remained the only way where Ukrainian troops might cross the Dnipro with tanks and heavy weapons during expected counteroffence.

Yes. This is the most probable reason. 

Poor victims  so many lost their homes, and so many animals have died  

[GeordieGirl]

16 hours ago, Osprey said:

When hearing about such events we should try really hard not to develop any negative feelings towards one side, or even start to hate it. That would mean losing neutrality.

I remember often an example that was given in one talk (unfortunately I don't remember if it was on Broadcasting or public talk in KH or even in Watchtower article). Scenario was that we may be living in a country that suppresses JWs. Then some other party may try to win on elections and promise to obey human rights including ending persecution of JWs. Even in such case we should do everything possible to remain neutral even in our hearts. So we have to control our minds too. For sure this would be very hard but Jehovah expects this from us. We are not part of this world. There is no scenario where that would not hold.

I imagine it must be very hard for all affected brothers to remain neutral even in hearts. I pray for them every day that Jehovah helps them remain neutral and help them maintain peace and faith. 

Brothers and sisters from Ukraine, we all love you very much! You are loved and valued and soon you will live in peace like every other human on earth!

Is this the talk you were thinking of?

Even if it's not, it is a good one to listen to. 😊

 

https://www.jw.org/en/library/videos/#en/mediaitems/VODPgmEvtMorningWorship/pub-jwb_201702_6_VIDEO

Edited June 7, 2023 by GeordieGirl

[Frances Bennett]

On 6/6/2023 at 1:57 PM, carlos said:

I was finding it hard to stay neutral in my heart on this conflict. After all, one side was clearly acting as a bully and invading its neighbor. They were raping, killing and torturing civilians. The other side  was just defending itself.

 

Something that helped me was a comment I heard in one of the last GB reports. An Ukrainian brother who had to flee the country said they were trembling every time they met a military checkpoint, whether the soldiers were Russian or Ukrainian, since they both used to commit the same atrocities. That helped me understand that, while it's true that one side started the war, actually both are just tools in Satan's hands.

 

What a great comment!

 

It's very hard to remain neutral as "news" isn't really news at all but propaganda!

 

If you look into the roots of the war in the Ukraine, the players in the 2014 troubles that are the seed of this latest conflict, the history of the nazi factions and who has funded them (look west), the 'special interests' that are in the Ukraine particularly for the US and the fueling and driving and financing of the conflict by NATO (although no men from the financing nations have put their necks on the line, only Ukrainian and Russian soldiers are doing that) you suddenly see the KOTN and the KOTS in equivalent, disgusting, satanic warmongering. It's just that the two horned wild beast has the appearance of a lamb.

 

If we are to truly be separate and neutral we have to see the frogs from Revelation 16 as the propaganda campaign that they are and remember that the ultimate outcome will be "to gather them together to the war of the great day of God the Almighty"

Edited June 25, 2023 by Frances Bennett
Typo

[Korotkiy]

On 6/25/2023 at 11:38 AM, Frances Bennett said:

 

What a great comment!

 

It's very hard to remain neutral as "news" isn't really news at all but propaganda!

 

If you look into the roots of the war in the Ukraine, the players in the 2014 troubles that are the seed of this latest conflict, the history of the nazi factions and who has funded them (look west), the 'special interests' that are in the Ukraine particularly for the US and the fueling and driving and financing of the conflict by NATO (although no men from the financing nations have put their necks on the line, only Ukrainian and Russian soldiers are doing that) you suddenly see the KOTN and the KOTS in equivalent, disgusting, satanic warmongering. It's just that the two horned wild beast has the appearance of a lamb.

 

If we are to truly be separate and neutral we have to see the frogs from Revelation 16 as the propaganda campaign that they are and remember that the ultimate outcome will be "to gather them together to the war of the great day of God the Almighty"

 

Sorry sister but I am living in Ukraine 50 years and NEVER saw Nazi here.

 

This is a typical russian propaganda to make equal between common nationalists that are present in any country as France, Russia, USA etc and Hitler`s posessors. If Nazi factions has really active here, then Urkaine never had selected Jew as president with 85%.

 

No doubt that KOTN and KOTS are Satanic parts, but no need to repeat dirty propaganda of one part.

 

Edited June 27, 2023 by Korotkiy

[PGgenius]

Some considerations and interim information not necessarily as important as only for some pro types🙂
The events of Wagner's military rebellion that escalated in the Russian chamber during Midsummer are a foretaste of what is to come, experts estimate.
for the first time since the Second World War, a clear threat picture is emerging for the Baltic Sea.

it is no coincidence that Yevgeny Prigozhin, the Wagner leader who incited the rebellion, was sent to Belarus and made into a big event.

- All the ingredients are there for Belarus to create a headache for the West. It is to be expected that it will start to happen there.
Among other things, large highways have been built from Minsk to the Ukrainian border. what is interesting is why they were built and who financed them, because Belarus does not have the resources for that.

- It fits Moscow's plans to start destabilizing the Baltic Sea region through Belarus. In this case, there is no talk of Russia's direct participation

Russia transported tactical nuclear weapons to Belarus before Midsummer. In the form of Prigozin, elements of the gray area moved to Belarus, who operate independently of all international agreements and legislation
it is very possible that after Putin, Russia will have an equally authoritarian and nationalistic leader.
 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Lähetä palautetta

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[PGgenius]

condensed source text

https://www.iltalehti.fi/ulkomaat/a/a008f831-9f03-437b-8f46-d47483c02fca

[Frances Bennett]

1 hour ago, Korotkiy said:

 

Sorry sister but I am living in Ukraine 50 years and NEVER saw Nazi here.

 

This is a typical russian propaganda to make equal between common nationalists that are present in any country as France, Russia, USA etc and Hitler`s posessors. If Nazi factions has really active here, then Urkaine never had selected Jew as president with 85%.

 

No doubt that KOTN and KOTS are Satanic parts, but no need to repeat dirty propaganda of one part.

 

 

It's funny actually I have never watched a Russian news report.

 

I first heard about the Ukrainian neo-nazi problem via quite few different news articles on the BBC in 2014-16. Although it's not really mentioned as much now, for some reason. If you type "BBC Ukraine Nazi" into YouTube all the old programmes are still there. Like this one.

 

 

There are also quite a few detailed and well resourced articles on non legacy media that document the long history of the problem in Ukraine. These articles are very well written and the sources and references are all listed, including UN reports on the problem from before this war.

 

I wouldn't post them on here though as I don't think its the place and would never want to focus on the negative.

 

I'm very very glad you never met a nazi though brother  I'm sorry if you felt I was passing on Russian propaganda. I thought it was well documented history from my watching of BBC news night for so many decades!

 

Edited June 27, 2023 by Frances Bennett
Typo

[Korotkiy]

It`s Okay dear sister. We are in the front of a different propaganda waves, sometimes from one side, sometimes from the other. It is hard to see what is real situation even you are in the center of war. 😀

Its not a problem for jouranilsts to find a several freaks and make a news that will fill to today`s news "hot" situation.

But anyway any Hitler and Stalin approval in Ukraine are criminal at the moment.  

Edited June 27, 2023 by Korotkiy

[carlos]

Yura, what do you know about the areas in conflict? Are there many brothers and sisters still there, or did most evacuate?

[Korotkiy]

Intersting that in the provided 2014 BBC interwiev young man has told in pure Russian (that is not shown, but I recognize him as a nature Russian speaker) "that anybody who likes Russia - please go to Russia".

So the problem was not in language or nasionality, it was a true policy issue. 

 

[Korotkiy]

3 minutes ago, carlos said:

Yura, what do you know about the areas in conflict? Are there many brothers and sisters still there, or did most evacuate?

Actually most of brothers and sisters has evacuated from occupated territory when it was possible and who has this possibility.

 

Everywhone has been pressly asked about a reason to stay here. Sisters from our kongregation evacuated from Nova Khahovka flooding after Russian explode told that there was a catastrohpe here.

 

About a territories in Ukraine somebody is returning now from abroad but many families are divided as mans are forbidden to leave Ukraine - but families are still abroad because of air attacks fear.

 

In our kongregation 3 families are still divided 1.5 years and it is not area of conflict.

But closer to the line it is a big problem.

 

[Jwanon]

weird to think this actually happened  https://www.jw.org/en/news/region/russia/president-putin-gives-parenting-award-to-jehovahs-witnesses/

[Korotkiy]

A very dangerous news is that probably Russians finishing to mine Zaporizzya nuclear power plant - the largest in the Europe. Very alarming that they already have evacuated all the Russian staff and those workers who have got the contract with Russian nuclear agency. Also they have provided all the people in the near city Energodar by jod pills (however expired in 1994)

 

This might indicate thet they are preparing to explode (probably cooling water lake and some other buildings) to stop Ukrainian troops offensive.

 

I don't think that this will be like Chernobyl nuclear case, but something like Fukushima maybe...

 

Big territory especially down to Dnipro and Black sea can be polluted. Nobody can know a results.

 

Of course Russians will declare that this was Ukrainian act, and they are already preparing for this in their mass media.

 

Previous explosion of Khahovka dam show that this can be very very real and sad scenario...

 

NYT recently has made investigation that dam has been exploded only from inside tunnel by russian troops, as being constructed on Cold war to stay on any outside bomb ever nuclear bomb. Anyway Russians blame Ukraine in this and all the future inhuman acts...

 

Many brothers still lives close to power station in million sites as Zaporizzya, Kherson and others...

 

I am worry about them..