DISCUSS COURT CASE HERE JW.org - Jehovah’s Witnesses Mobilize Global Response to Threat of Ban in Russia

[And_Ray]

The court announces a break until 12 April 2017 10:00.

[UpstateKate]

I wonder if he is in contact with someone in he courtroom and the official website hasn't been updated yet. If so it means that our brothers can for sure have the Memorial in peace!

 

it updated, hooray! So happy for our Russian brotherhood!

Edited April 7, 2017 by UpstateKate

[Daniela]

2 minutes ago, And_Ray said:

The court announces a break until 12 April 2017 10:00.

Great! Ready for the Memorial than!

[Thomas Walker]

April 12th Local time, which, hopefully, is the day after the Memorial.

 

I've been following the Live Coverage, and trying to remind myself that logic and common sense have never been part of this whole trial. But that's another five days, and in the meantime, the letters pour in.

 

Jah is the God of the Impossible.

[Bluebell]

Jehovah did it with Style......again...

[BlackSnow]

Anton Chivchalov on Twitter posted that the hearing will continue on April 12th. Any confirmation?

Yes, adjourned till 12 April at 10am

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[Gi-Gi]

13 minutes ago, And_Ray said:

Anton Chivchalov on Twitter posted that the hearing will continue on April 12th. Any confirmation?

 

Moderator Please delete! Got excited!!!!!

Please 13:25	The court announces a break until 12 April 2017 10:00.     Audio recordings of speeches: Vasily Kalin   00:27         16:34   Sergey Cherepanov           21:59

Edited April 7, 2017 by Gi-Gi

[sunshine]

11"15 Our Lawyer Zehenkova speaks:  He repeats that if in 100 years the MoJ cannot provide any proof that we are extremists, why are we here?

 

Our Lawyer point out that our literature was declared  8 years ago, wo why can you not prove that in that period (when supposely our members had read the "extremist" literature) we haven committed as single act of terrorism, vandalism or violance?

 

Our Lawyer points out that our books were included on the extremist list BEFORE an adjustment in the law that that said that criticizing other religion will not be regarded as "extremist" 

 

11"25 Our Lawyer contintues:  If we are so "extremist" why are only a few of our books on the extremist list?  Most are considered perfectly ok.  AND the few that are on the list got there because of a few so called "experts" that were not even qualified.  We were not even allowed to present our side of the argument.  For example they banned  one of our broshures that is mostly  pictures because of the sentence "avoid bad acts".  

 

(laughter) Our Lawyer continues ... ok that seems funny but really its not, so funny when it will effect thousands of faithful.  You (MoJ) are even including books without telling us WHY they are on the list of extremists.  If this you can just put books on a banned list without explanation Russia will soon have no books left!  He points out that they even tried to put the BIBLE on their banned list - even though that was illegal since the law says the bible and bible texts cannot be viewed as "extremist"

 

Their lawyer:   Yeah well in that case we  classified the bible not as the bible but as a book (more laughter)

 

 

11"39 Our Lawyer points out that the European High Court (Highest court in Europe) has already decided that our literature contains no calls to violence  Our Lawyer points out that up til now you have always said that the ban on the literature should not effect the individual brothers and sisters yet what you are saying  here in this case proves that you have done an about turn on that.

 

11"55 Our Lawyer provides evidence we have not imported any banned literature after the ban.  All these problems come from you declaring literature "extremist" AFTER they were legally imported.  You (the MoJ) have not respected the law, you can't prosecute people for breaking a law that didn't exist at the time!  In the end you say we are extremists but you have not produced any victims of our so called extremist activities.

 

12"12 Anther of our Lawyers Master Axe (?) points out on the 2nd charge of "financing extremist groups" (ie the Congregations) this charge cannot stand since the HQ Bethel doesn't finance them at all they are financially independent groups that use their money to pay their utility bills and donate to charity.

 

[BlackSnow]

13:25
The court announces a break until 12 April 2017 10:00.

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[Gi-Gi]

 I love you all so much have a very good rest! Have A fabulous weekend! and a most memorable Memorial!

[BlackSnow]

Our brothers and sisters in Russia can at least concentrate on the memorial of Christ's death.

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[Adelin]

It could have been April 10 or 11, but it is 12. Our first wish is fulfilled. They can have the memorial in peace. 

Edited April 7, 2017 by Adelin

[Guri]

I'm back now and I can see the good news! Court hearing will resume on 12th of April! So so happy for brothers in Russia! Now without any trouble brothers will attend the Memorial!

 

[Friends just call me Ross]

1 minute ago, Adelin said:

It could be April 10 or 11, but it is 12. Our first wish is fulfilled. They can have the memorial in peace. 

I'm so happy, I could cry! 

Praise Jah!!!

[Bluebell]

is this not  strange? .....delay until the 12th......few days before Eastern?  Why?

and they can't disturb our  Memorial because the world is watching........

 

Is there a reason......like last Memorial before the great T.????

 

.....

[timpin]

Could someone please translate those audio files into English.

 

Audio recordings of speeches:

Vasily Kalin	00:27         16:34
Sergey Cherepanov	21:59

Edited April 7, 2017 by timpin

[sunshine]

SIMPLIFIED (For anyone interested)

 

12"17 Our Lawyer Axes (?) points out:  The court is being asked to apply a double standard:  At first it was said we don't need to hear from the 395 congregations because they will not be affected by what we decide about the HQ Bethel, and now you turn around and say the opposite, that whatever happens to Bethel will happen to everyone one of the congregations!

 

Our Lawyer continues:  There is not legal connection between the congregations and the HQ hey are not "branches" of the Bethel.  Any connection between the congregations and the Bethel HQ is religious and spiritual.  Financially and legally they are completely seperate.  Plus since the majority of these congregations  (380) have never received any notification of doing anything illegal, how can we decide in this court to ban them ALL?!   There have been hundreds of raids and examination of our Kingdom halls  and they found nothing illegal, so why are we even here talking about banning all these congregations?!

 

12"52:   Our Lawyer continues:  You (MoJ) say we are here because you found "new evidence of extremism" but that amounts to a few fines given to some local congregations because you recently "found" (read: planted) banned literature in their hall.  But we were not invited attend these cases, we were not told that these cases would be used in this case here to close the Bethel and ban our religion.  And when we look at this "new evidence" that bought us here today, we see there is documented evidence of the authorities planting the banned literature in the halls, throwing our brothers to the ground, not allowing them even to see what is being done around them...  Oh and by the way one of the books "discovred" by the authorities on our premises someone had written "property of an Othodox anti sect group" 

 

In closing Our Lawyer notes that you want to ban the congregations as well as the Bethel HeadQuarters  because you call them "structural units" (branches) of the HQ, but the term doesn't even exit for churches (it only applies to political parties)

 

 

COURT ENDS:  Back on 12th April.  

[sand]

Here is the transcript of the speech of Vasily Kalin,  found on Anton Chivchalov facebook page :

I am not a lawyer, so I will try to speak as simply as possible for you, your honor, and for the MOJ.

The MOJ filed a motion to declare the AC extremist and liquidate all LROs in Russia. There are 395 LROS. Is this lawful? I don’t think so. The AC disagrees with this. For 26 years the AC has never been charged with violations of the Federal Law on Religion or the Law on Extremism.

I have a question as the Chairman. If we were good for 26 years, on what date did we become extremist? What did the AC do that all of a sudden it's considered extremist?

The MOJ alleges that they intend to protect the public in the fight against terrorism. However, if the judge grants the claim we will return to the dark history of our past, rather than fight extremism. We will restrict the rights of 175,000 people. Liquidation of all LROs will be interpreted as a ban of the peaceful worship of JW, gathering together and reading the Bible.

The activity of the AC has been suspended, the bank accounts frozen. The AC cannot even pay state fees. The AC has been included by the MOJ in the list of extremist and terrorist organizations, such as Al Qaeda and ISIS. Granting the claim would be the extremist activity and return us to the dark history of our past. JW are open in 240 countries, including all countries of Europe. There can only be one just decision: deny the MOJ claim.

JW are not extremist. They will never be. They are peaceful citizens who follow Bible’s commands to pray and live a quiet life – Timothy 2:1,2; Romans 13:1. JW have deep respect for the authority and for the neighbor. We are not extremists. We have been active in Russia for 100+ years. We have never been charged with extremism. Rather, we often receive praise and appreciation for our good works. The Christian teachings of JW are based exclusively on the Bible and do not encourage extremist activity. Based on this situation, it is a shame that we are returning to the past.

I received a note that I was rehabilitated as a victim of political repression. What does the MOJ plan on doing for people who are viewed as extremist? Therefore, I believe that the claim by the MOJ is a return to the past. We face prison time and other persecution. In the Soviet times we were facing charges of “enemy of the state”, now we are being charged with extremism.

If the court returns to the path offered by the MOJ to liquidate the AC and all LROs, we will return to the dark past. I like what one official said, “You can liquidate a legal entity, but never someone’s faith." In Taganrog people have already been sentenced and their families persecuted.

Our Fundamentals of Beliefs indicate that we treat others like we want to be treated – Matthew 7:12. We share our faith in harmony with the Bible’s command to preach – Matthew 24:14. We want people to draw close to God and live forever on earth.

In Soviet Times JW were subject to serious persecution. Thousands of JW were exiled to Sibera, their homes were confiscated, they were viewed as anti-Soviet and persecuted in the Gulag just for being JW.

My family was exiled and later rehabilitiesd. I was born in Ukraine. On 8 April when I was 4 years old, together with my family I was exiled to Siberia, to Irkutsk. It took 20 days to arrive. There were men, women, children, without toilets, without food. We were exiled in harmony with Stalin’s command to wipe out JW.

My parents and all other JW at that time could have escaped this fate. We simply could have signed a document renouncing our faith. Interestingly, a criminal would never have this ability. Thus it is clear: JW are not criminals, yet they were persecuted. The state simply was against the position of these people. Those who exiled continue to preach and share their faith with others.

JW have not lost their deep convictions, they continue to be honest people who show love to all others despite their nationality and race. This is because they value the Bible’s command to love your neighbor as yourself.

Yes, my childhood was full of hunger, poverty, and mockery. I asked my mother for some bread, and she would turn around so that I would not see her tears. Mom said, “Son, wait a bit, soon we will have lots of bread!" At that time I thought, “Lots of bread! We may have an entire loaf!"

(Some in the audience are in tears)

I want to remind the MOJ that the request to ban the JW would hurt those people who wish to live a peaceful, happy life. I call on the court not to return to the past and reject the MOJ’s claim

[Daniela]

Thank you, Rosie. I really liked you simplified version. You need a break now... till 12th April.

[sunshine]

 

Phew!  That was quite a morning!

 

I agree with everyone about the Memorial - there is no reason that they don't resume on Monday (other than their Lawyers need a rest after being knocked out today).  I am personally convinced Jehovah is behind what is going on and he wanted his people to enjoy the encouragement a memorial together will be.  I am very moved by the privilege of witnessing our brave and eloquent modern-day "Paul's"  fighting for the truth before the highest courts in the land, with such grace and courage.

 

May Jehovah bless them all including any non-witness lawyers and experts that have had the courage to come to our aid.

 

Peace out!

 

Rosie

 

 

[hatcheckgirl]

The date is good for our brothers to have a good Memorial (I always wonder, will it be the last?). 

In the meantime, much political trouble is brewing in Russia, what with the St Petersburg bombing, civil unrests last week, and now the US strikes on Syria.  Russia is going to be like a bear with a sore head.  Really, only Jehovah can keep our brothers safe from that.

[Daniela]

Our heavenly and earthly theocratic ministry of defense are unbeatable!

[EccentricM]

Just got home from a day out in town (I don't get out much lol), read the whole case. Looking good so far. Some quite funny moments in there too x) 

[New World Explorer]

I am also puzzled by this date (12th April)

Jehovah's hand is there for sure.

Brothers can sing loud and clear during Memorial!

[SUNRAY]

Is it possible that other court cases were already scheduled for Monday and Tuesday? Whatever the reason, Jehovah certainly acts "with style"!!!